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#2022063 - 10/17/17 11:42 AM Re: Show me your best Candidates. ***** [Re: casey]
58hawk Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 12/16/09
Loc: KCMO
Originally Posted By: casey
Originally Posted By: dgless21
Christ. I thought I already hated Zenger as much as possible. It just keeps getting worse.

http://amp.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article179218666.html


So that's $6.4 million in HC OC DC and AD buyouts if they clean house after this season, including Zenger's buyout.

No proven coach or AD will want to come to KU, so KU will have to overpay for a risky hire to both offices. And Zenger is Self's buddy, so Self may get ticked off and leave.

This is going to be fun to watch.
Fun for you maybe but not KU fans.
_________________________
KU Coach Naismith invented the game so you get to play it.

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#2022067 - 10/17/17 12:37 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: EstebanBugatti]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: EstebanBugatti
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Also, my opinions on if anyone is getting fired shortly or not are based off of things I've heard from within the Athletic Department from a couple sources I trust as they're right way more often than not. They've also got the access to know the facts.


I hate to break this to you but your "sources" don't mean [censored] if they're in the AD. The decisions will come down from the very top.
My sources aren't within the AD, but like I said a couple people I know who have access to know more of what's going on within the AD than most all of us.

No doubt any decisions will come from the top (Girod) as I don't think there's anyway that Zenger is gonna fire Beaty before 2018 unless he's forced to by a big donor or donors or Girod.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2022068 - 10/17/17 12:46 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: Kman_blue]
EstebanBugatti Offline
Big Dipper

Registered: 12/07/15
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: EstebanBugatti
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Also, my opinions on if anyone is getting fired shortly or not are based off of things I've heard from within the Athletic Department from a couple sources I trust as they're right way more often than not. They've also got the access to know the facts.


I hate to break this to you but your "sources" don't mean [censored] if they're in the AD. The decisions will come down from the very top.
My sources aren't within the AD, but like I said a couple people I know who have access to know more of what's going on within the AD than most all of us.

No doubt any decisions will come from the top (Girod) as I don't think there's anyway that Zenger is gonna fire Beaty before 2018 unless he's forced to by a big donor or donors or Girod.


Zenger will never fire Beaty. The new AD that replaces Zenger will.

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#2022069 - 10/17/17 12:52 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: JimWest]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: JimWest
Unlike you, I possess the power of logic.

You say that no "proven" P-5 coach would take the job because of high coaching turnover where the AD won't give them time or support. This is a completely stupid premise. Do you know why?
Not quite what I said. I said most current proven P-5 level coaches will look at our situation from today until the end of this season, if we fired Beaty during that time, and not be confident that our AD (now here's an important part your microcephalic brain missed) and/or boosters won't give them the time or support they think they'd need to be successful here.


Originally Posted By: JimWest
It is stupid because the AD will be the first to go. Any P-5 coach considering the KU job will therefore not be thinking that the AD won't give them time because...

(now hold on to your brain - this is going to hurt)

there will be a new AD.
If Zenger gets fired within that same time frame, I doubt any new AD would be hired sooner than about March or April of 2018 and I doubt they in turn would fire Beaty immediately at that time. BUT if they did the timing would be a lot different than any firing from now until the end of this season. That'd change a lot of the perspective of any current P-5 level coaches who could be interested in the job.

Again, your microbrain missed the important part of my entire premise. Timing. It's the timing stupid.


Originally Posted By: JimWest
Only rural morons have concocted this ridiculous notion that the only way to attract a successful coach is by wallowing in failure for LONGER.

This, of course, is the same mindset that keeps people on the farm. "GEE WhiZ CleEtUZ LET'S StiCk iT oUT fOr AnoTher SeAZun AnD thEN We'LL ProVE we Are WorTHY oF THAt TrIp TO THE bIG CITy So We CAn EXpERieNCE the RAinFoReST cAfE!"
The Rainforest Cafe? LOL Do those even still exist?

With your predilection with "rural" brains and farm/farmers...what happened to you on the farm you grew up on? Did Bubba have his way with you 1 too many times? Have a bad incident with a pig and corncob? I'm sure it was the pig's fault.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2022070 - 10/17/17 12:56 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: casey]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: casey
Originally Posted By: dgless21
Christ. I thought I already hated Zenger as much as possible. It just keeps getting worse.

http://amp.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article179218666.html


So that's $6.4 million in HC OC DC and AD buyouts if they clean house after this season, including Zenger's buyout.

No proven coach or AD will want to come to KU, so KU will have to overpay for a risky hire to both offices. And Zenger is Self's buddy, so Self may get ticked off and leave.

This is going to be fun to watch.
Don't think so. Don't think Beaty's buyout is guaranteed, but assistants are a different story.

Also, Self is not tied to Zenger. There's no way in the world he's gonna leave because we fired Zenger. He's not Roy Williams in this regard.

With the resources KU has and the athletic budget and our current Chancellor, there's no way KU would have a problem attracting a high quality AD. Dream on IowaBoy.

You Iowa St. fans hope and pray all of that would happen.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2022071 - 10/17/17 01:02 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: EstebanBugatti]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: EstebanBugatti
Zenger will never fire Beaty. The new AD that replaces Zenger will.
I agree, don't think Zenger will fire Beaty.

Also, don't think Zenger is getting fired before the end of 2017 either. Could be wrong here, but that's the feel I got from Girod every time I've heard him speak or have even talked to him myself. I've also heard nothing that leads me to believe any big donors are going to step up and force it sooner.

So, if he does get fired let say at the beginning of January, it'll probably be April or maybe even later before a new AD is announced and I don't think they'd immediately fire Beaty unless those are his marching orders/prerequisite to taking the job. My best guess would be the new AD would have Beaty on a short leash and give him part or all of the 2018 season to prove himself.

Don't shoot the messenger here. I'm not telling you what I think should happen, but rather what I think will happen.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2022072 - 10/17/17 01:41 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: Kman_blue]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Not quite what I said.


Yeah, it's pretty much exactly what you said.

Quote:
I said most current proven P-5 level coaches will look at our situation from today until the end of this season, if we fired Beaty during that time, and not be confident that our AD (now here's an important part your microcephalic brain missed) and/or boosters won't give them the time or support they think they'd need to be successful here.


9 years is plenty of time and support. Facts, though. You're right, f science! YEE HAWWW.


Quote:
If Zenger gets fired within that same time frame, I doubt any new AD would be hired sooner than about March or April of 2018


lol

Based on what, the crop harvest calendar?

Quote:
and I doubt they in turn would fire Beaty immediately at that time.


Sure they would.

Quote:
BUT if they did the timing would be a lot different than any firing from now until the end of this season.


huh?

Quote:
That'd change a lot of the perspective of any current P-5 level coaches who could be interested in the job.


Sounds like you're back tracking now, as usual.

Quote:
Again, your microbrain missed the important part of my entire premise. Timing. It's the timing stupid.


OLE BESSIE'S IN HEAT! IT'S ALL ABOuT THe TIMINg!


Quote:
The Rainforest Cafe? LOL Do those even still exist?


Oh yeah, it's a constant parade of ruralites through their doors. You must be one of those uppity ruralites that thinks Longhorn Steakhouse is fine dining.

Quote:
With your predilection with "rural" brains and farm/farmers...what happened to you on the farm you grew up on? Did Bubba have his way with you 1 too many times? Have a bad incident with a pig and corncob? I'm sure it was the pig's fault.


I see you're a Harvey Weinstein supporter too. Sorry, but sexual abuse is not something to joke about. But, ruralites think it is because they live in such a tiny world that they don't understand that other people may actually have experienced real things or have a different viewpoint or background. You're showing your true colors.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2022073 - 10/17/17 02:43 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: Kman_blue]
casey Offline
hello

Registered: 04/06/08
Loc: elsewhere
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
With your predilection with "rural" brains and farm/farmers...what happened to you on the farm you grew up on? Did Bubba have his way with you 1 too many times? Have a bad incident with a pig and corncob? I'm sure it was the pig's fault.


You're the kind of Jayhawk fan that embarrasses civilized Jayhawk fans.

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#2022074 - 10/17/17 02:45 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: 58hawk]
casey Offline
hello

Registered: 04/06/08
Loc: elsewhere
Originally Posted By: 58hawk
Originally Posted By: casey
Originally Posted By: dgless21
Christ. I thought I already hated Zenger as much as possible. It just keeps getting worse.

http://amp.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article179218666.html


So that's $6.4 million in HC OC DC and AD buyouts if they clean house after this season, including Zenger's buyout.

No proven coach or AD will want to come to KU, so KU will have to overpay for a risky hire to both offices. And Zenger is Self's buddy, so Self may get ticked off and leave.

This is going to be fun to watch.
Fun for you maybe but not KU fans.


OK, "fun" is the wrong word, since I honestly do want KU football to be good.

Still, it's a really fascinating management problem.

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#2022075 - 10/17/17 02:46 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: Kman_blue]
casey Offline
hello

Registered: 04/06/08
Loc: elsewhere
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: casey
Originally Posted By: dgless21
Christ. I thought I already hated Zenger as much as possible. It just keeps getting worse.

http://amp.kansascity.com/sports/college/big-12/university-of-kansas/article179218666.html


So that's $6.4 million in HC OC DC and AD buyouts if they clean house after this season, including Zenger's buyout.

No proven coach or AD will want to come to KU, so KU will have to overpay for a risky hire to both offices. And Zenger is Self's buddy, so Self may get ticked off and leave.

This is going to be fun to watch.
Don't think so. Don't think Beaty's buyout is guaranteed, but assistants are a different story.

Also, Self is not tied to Zenger. There's no way in the world he's gonna leave because we fired Zenger. He's not Roy Williams in this regard.

With the resources KU has and the athletic budget and our current Chancellor, there's no way KU would have a problem attracting a high quality AD. Dream on IowaBoy.

You Iowa St. fans hope and pray all of that would happen.


http://www2.kusports.com/news/2016/dec/12/incentives-details-termination-or-buyout-place-new/

Beaty's got a $3 million buyout if fired without cause.

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#2022077 - 10/17/17 04:05 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: casey]
beenahawk Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 09/01/02
Loc: Topeka, Kansas
Originally Posted By: casey


Well hopefully being a dismal coach of an even more dismal team that can't beat their way out of a wet paper bag in 3 years is "cause"! whistle

as for Dr. Z? I'm waiting for Girod to drop the "Vote of confidence bomb", that is always the kiss of death!

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#2022078 - 10/17/17 04:24 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: Kman_blue]
moose1 Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 12/29/06
Loc: Wichita
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: EstebanBugatti
Zenger will never fire Beaty. The new AD that replaces Zenger will.
I agree, don't think Zenger will fire Beaty.

Also, don't think Zenger is getting fired before the end of 2017 either. Could be wrong here, but that's the feel I got from Girod every time I've heard him speak or have even talked to him myself. I've also heard nothing that leads me to believe any big donors are going to step up and force it sooner.

So, if he does get fired let say at the beginning of January, it'll probably be April or maybe even later before a new AD is announced and I don't think they'd immediately fire Beaty unless those are his marching orders/prerequisite to taking the job. My best guess would be the new AD would have Beaty on a short leash and give him part or all of the 2018 season to prove himself.

Don't shoot the messenger here. I'm not telling you what I think should happen, but rather what I think will happen.


Good point on the timing. If nothing else that probably saves Zenger and Beaty as well at least in the short term. If the season ends as badly as I think it will the wheels will start for getting rid of Zenger. Heck the hardest part of the schedule is yet to come so it will be hard to show improvement. If KU gets a new AD say in spring or summer, I think Beaty gets all of 2018 to show what he can do. I don't think he gets clipped midway no matter what. If he doesn't show substantial improvement by the end of 2018 the new AD fires Beaty, and brings in his own guy.

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#2022079 - 10/17/17 05:16 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: jayhawk1985]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
There is absolutely no way that Zenger is fired and Beaty isn't.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2022080 - 10/17/17 05:17 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: jayhawk1985]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
The whole reason for firing Zenger is because he hired Beaty. You can't fire him for hiring a guy and then still give the guy you fired him for hiring a chance to prove that the guy you fired actually hired the right guy.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2022081 - 10/17/17 05:18 PM Re: Show me your best Candidates. [Re: moose1]
pizzanbeer Offline
Max Falkenstien

Registered: 07/03/09
Originally Posted By: moose1
Good point on the timing. If nothing else that probably saves Zenger and Beaty as well at least in the short term. If the season ends as badly as I think it will the wheels will start for getting rid of Zenger. Heck the hardest part of the schedule is yet to come so it will be hard to show improvement. If KU gets a new AD say in spring or summer, I think Beaty gets all of 2018 to show what he can do. I don't think he gets clipped midway no matter what. If he doesn't show substantial improvement by the end of 2018 the new AD fires Beaty, and brings in his own guy.


This makes sense. Hire the new AD late spring or early summer and then he works on a list of replacement candidates for Beaty. Then over the summer the new AD contacts the coaches agents to see if the coaches have interest in the KU job. If Beaty does not improve in 2018 then the new AD fires him and takes the best candidate from his short list.

The tricky thing for the new AD will be timing the hiring of Beaty's replacement since the early signing day for recruiting will be in early December. I liked how the Wash State AD negotiated a contract with Leach so Leach already was locked in as the new coach immediately at the end of the Washington State season. Hopefully the new AD can do something similar to smooth out the transition between Beaty and the new coach.

I would not mind the new AD firing Beaty over the summer if he could bring in an experienced coach like Les Miles to take over for next season. That would be the smoothest transition for recruiting. Miles could use the 2018 season to decide if he wants to keep any of the current assistant coaches like Hull and Meacham. If Miles has some better assistant coaches he wants to immediately bring in then he could go with that if he prefers.


Edited by pizzanbeer (10/17/17 05:43 PM)

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