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#2021590 - 10/11/17 08:52 AM Re: Unpopular message [Re: EstebanBugatti]
Magicman Offline
Phog Fanatic

Registered: 10/07/13
I'm with a lot of others on the board. I think Beaty should get, at least, next year and maybe two more years. Almost, everyone agreed that it would take at least five years to get this thing turned around. I have seen quite a bit of improvement from our offense (not counting our last game). On the other hand, Bowen is another story. Our defense is pathetic and there are no excuses for playing this bad in year three. I really can't believe that Bowen has not been fired, or at least demoted to a position coach! Unacceptable!

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#2021591 - 10/11/17 11:52 AM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
KUCO_VOC Offline
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
I've seen enough chaos on offense (now who is QB!?!) and turnovers, along with the historic levels reached on "defense". But Beaty is delusional and says he has faith in Bowen's 122nd ranked defense. He is far worse than scooterman, and that's saying a lot. Time to make a change internally, and get Beaty to move DC duties to someone else during the season. Then boot Bowen to the curb at the end of it.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2021592 - 10/11/17 12:20 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: KUCO_VOC]
Jman1 Offline
Big Dipper

Registered: 12/12/03
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
I've seen enough chaos on offense (now who is QB!?!) and turnovers, along with the historic levels reached on "defense". But Beaty is delusional and says he has faith in Bowen's 122nd ranked defense. He is far worse than scooterman, and that's saying a lot. Time to make a change internally, and get Beaty to move DC duties to someone else during the season. Then boot Bowen to the curb at the end of it.


Not to stir the pot any more than it already is, but who do you believe we have on the coaching staff that is capable of coaching defense, even on a Powder Puff level? We already have powder puff level.

I guess the administration could beg and plead to bring in the Butt Nut, Jimmy West


Edited by Jman1 (10/11/17 12:23 PM)

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#2021595 - 10/11/17 01:21 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Jman1]
KUCO_VOC Offline
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
Originally Posted By: Jman1
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
I've seen enough chaos on offense (now who is QB!?!) and turnovers, along with the historic levels reached on "defense". But Beaty is delusional and says he has faith in Bowen's 122nd ranked defense. He is far worse than scooterman, and that's saying a lot. Time to make a change internally, and get Beaty to move DC duties to someone else during the season. Then boot Bowen to the curb at the end of it.


Not to stir the pot any more than it already is, but who do you believe we have on the coaching staff that is capable of coaching defense, even on a Powder Puff level? We already have powder puff level.

I guess the administration could beg and plead to bring in the Butt Nut, Jimmy West
What if Mrs. Kansas is now DC, then CB can be a stay at home mom?

Seriously, I would give the DC position interim to the linebackers coach. After all, only three big time defensive teams are ranked worst than Kansas.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2021596 - 10/11/17 02:06 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: Yardbirdbob
Not sure why you are so confident Beaty makes it to next year.
For a couple of reasons.

1st, I knew as of a week ago, a couple key big money donors were still all in with coach Beaty and Zenger.
2nd, Girod is solid on Zenger right now and for the immediate future. Girod appears to also be solid on coach Beaty. Don't think Girod is going to fire Zenger within the next year and a half or so.
3rd, If Zenger is going to be here, then coach Beaty is for sure going to be here.

It would take one, or more likely a couple of influential donors to really press for change for anything to happen before the end of 2018 IMHO. Don't see that happening right now.

I think coach Beaty is going to get 2018 to prove himself before the people who make the decisions and/or have the influence decide to move on if he still hasn't started showing tangible improvement on the field.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2021597 - 10/11/17 03:35 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
dgless21 Online   mad
Local Deity

Registered: 03/27/05
Loc: Lawrence Beer Co.
I've heard pretty consistently he'll get at least non-conference next year.
_________________________


Hail to thee our Alma Mater, hail to old KU!

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#2021599 - 10/11/17 03:57 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
pizzanbeer Offline
Max Falkenstien

Registered: 07/03/09
It might be in our long term best interest to have Beaty keep Bowen at DC. That will ensure Beaty fails and force Girod to clean out the rat nest of incompetence in Zenger, Beaty and Bowen.

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#2021602 - 10/11/17 05:27 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
58hawk Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 12/16/09
Loc: KCMO
I understand losing but we haven't even been competitive in the last two. Beaty is losing in scoring margins as much as Weis and Gill. The slow starts still baffle me and I want to know why they can't figure that out. The first three touchdowns by Tech was like a knife through butter. Why does it take Bowen so long to make adjustments?
_________________________
KU Coach Naismith invented the game so you get to play it.

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#2021604 - 10/11/17 05:42 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: 58hawk]
beenahawk Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 09/01/02
Loc: Topeka, Kansas
Originally Posted By: 58hawk
I understand losing but we haven't even been competitive in the last two. Beaty is losing in scoring margins as much as Weis and Gill. The slow starts still baffle me and I want to know why they can't figure that out. The first three touchdowns by Tech was like a knife through butter. Why does it take Bowen so long to make adjustments?
You hit the nail on the head! It isn't JUST the crappy football, shoot, we are KU Grid fans for crying out loud. God knows we have decades and decades of experience in losing. If we had a coaching staff that put a hard nosed product on the field that won 4 to 6 games a year with a bowl birth of some sort every three of four years, the vast majority of us would be thrilled beyond repair. Heading into this season, many (NOT ME!) thought DB and crew would actually win 4 to 6 and maybe pull off a huge upset or at least keep a big dog wondering until the final seconds. Like Mason did with the Bugeaters back in 1993 or Mangino did with the Bevos in 04. DB appears to be farther away from even an average team than he was 2 years ago. Every other coach hired to turn things around I can recall in my lifetime of watching KU ( Pepper, Fam, Gottfried, Mason, Mangino) with the exception of Chuckles and now Beaty showed vast improvement from year one to three. Hell, DB's teams aren't even good enough to stay after halftime for those willing to buy the ticket and make the trip.

In all honesty, surely there is an attorney who frequents this board....is it time to file the class action lawsuit against KAI? This crap needs to be stopped somehow!

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#2021608 - 10/11/17 11:23 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
moose1 Offline
Max Falkenstien

Registered: 12/29/06
Loc: Wichita
I am assuming Beaty gets one more year. That said if the season ends with a bunch more games like the Tech game, who knows.

I must say this whole notion that a coach needs 5 years to rebuild is a bunch of crap. What program has taken that long to show signs of progress. I would say none, or if there is one it is the exception. Most programs that turn it around show signs in years 2 and 3 of progress. I look at this team, and there is no progress. Anyone who says there is progress, is just pumping sunshine. I have heard the same garbage for the last 9 years that the team is showing improvement. If there was improvement KU would not be the worst P5 program out there by far. As for this year's team I am pretty sure they get beaten by last year's team. That is going backward. Being this bad does nothing for recruiting. I am skeptical we hold on to the talented players that have given a verbal commitment. I just don't think a team can be this bad, and get players to play for them. I don't care how much they like the coach.

I will say Beaty was handed a sh!t show, and probably deserves an extra year because of it. I don't see him doing anything with it, but he probably deserves that shot.

Overall I think KU is a long ways from being even somewhat relevant. When they are, we will look back and Beaty will have had nothing to do with that.

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#2021610 - 10/12/17 12:53 AM Re: Unpopular message [Re: moose1]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: moose1
I must say this whole notion that a coach needs 5 years to rebuild is a bunch of crap. What program has taken that long to show signs of progress. I would say none, or if there is one it is the exception. Most programs that turn it around show signs in years 2 and 3 of progress.
I think it depends on what you mean by rebuilding a program. Showing signs of progress versus turning it around versus a rebuild are 3 different things IMO.

Is this team rebuilt? My answer, No.

Is this team turned around? I don't think anybody thinks so, including myself.

Has this team shown signs of progress? I think it has in certain areas, but not at all in other areas. More of a mixed bag, but this year's team has definitely regressed from last year's team and that's not a good sign.

Originally Posted By: moose1
Being this bad does nothing for recruiting. I am skeptical we hold on to the talented players that have given a verbal commitment. I just don't think a team can be this bad, and get players to play for them. I don't care how much they like the coach.

This worries me too, but I've heard recently that they're still committed to KU and not just because they gave a verbal earlier in the year, but they're still committed to our program and coaches right now, even after this past weekend's loss.

I think it's hard to fully understand from an outsiders view (all of us) how important those personal relationships with the coaches are.

If I had to rank just how committed I think the top 3 guys are right now, I'd put them as Williams, Harris, then Jason from most committed to least committed. Least committed in this context doesn't at all mean he's not still committed 100% at this point in time, just that if 1 of these guys did flip or decommit I'd guess it would more likely be him than the others. Haven't heard anything at all though that would lead me to believe any of them are even thinking about it right now either.

I think we've already lost the guys who weren't really committed KU or the coaches, but rather committed to the idea and vibe of KU as they were told it and experienced it when they visited.

While I'm confident that we'll hold on to most of the top guys we've got committed right now, I'm still a little anxious about it. I'm really more worried about filling out the rest of this class right now. I think they may have 2 more guys quietly committed right now, but other than that I haven't heard about anyone else looking like they may commit anytime soon. That worries me a lot.

Originally Posted By: moose1
I will say Beaty was handed a sh!t show, and probably deserves an extra year because of it. I don't see him doing anything with it, but he probably deserves that shot.
That's obviously the 64 million dollar question. Right now it doesn't look promising, but that's why the old cliche about you have to actually play the games to find out exists.

Originally Posted By: moose1
Overall I think KU is a long ways from being even somewhat relevant. When they are, we will look back and Beaty will have had nothing to do with that.
Now that's a bit harsh IMHO. I agree that the team is not performing well at all right now and even looks to have regressed from last year or at least from the team from the 2nd half of last year. Despite all of that, I still think coach Beaty deserves some credit for building this roster back up as quickly as he has. It still isn't where it needs to be, but he's got it further along than I thought it would be at this point. He's also done a great job at mending a ton of bridges that were burnt by previous coaches and that's important for the longer term and not just something to feel good about. He's done a tremendous job of getting our facilities improved too. Don't think a lot of that would have been done if he wasn't our coach.

So, I think Beaty has done a lot of good things for setting the foundation of the program even if he ultimately fails as the HC on the field I think it'll be set up a lot better for the next coach to succeed more easily. IF that's what happens with Beaty in the end.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2021612 - 10/12/17 08:11 AM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
KUCO_VOC Offline
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
Kman & moose make some good points directly above my comments here. My ramblings are that we have reached Gameball level team roster, and that, like Bud Moore as a coach, giving Beaty the reins will be like a roller coaster ride. Unlike Moore however, the "ride" is modified to not allow any hills to be climbed, just valleys. Still feel Bowen hasn't shown enough talent as DC to be continuing. Perhaps put him in charge of changing the facilities as a Zenger assistant. After all, Zenger horse collared Beaty with the guy initially. Seeing Beaty realize he can't win as Kansas University HC is cringeworthy in the post game interviews now. Recruiting for 2018 is now hovering at 10 recruits giving Beaty's team ranking a 247 source position at #70 or thereabouts. But I still feel that the right turn around candidate is out there to make Kansas a relevant football program as decent as ISU.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2021627 - 10/12/17 12:44 PM Re: Unpopular message [Re: KUCO_VOC]
Yardbirdbob Offline
Phog Fanatic

Registered: 10/07/12
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
Kman & moose make some good points directly above my comments here. My ramblings are that we have reached Gameball level team roster, and that, like Bud Moore as a coach, giving Beaty the reins will be like a roller coaster ride. Unlike Moore however, the "ride" is modified to not allow any hills to be climbed, just valleys. Still feel Bowen hasn't shown enough talent as DC to be continuing. Perhaps put him in charge of changing the facilities as a Zenger assistant. After all, Zenger horse collared Beaty with the guy initially. Seeing Beaty realize he can't win as Kansas University HC is cringeworthy in the post game interviews now. Recruiting for 2018 is now hovering at 10 recruits giving Beaty's team ranking a 247 source position at #70 or thereabouts. But I still feel that the right turn around candidate is out there to make Kansas a relevant football program as decent as ISU.



"Seeing Beaty realize he can't win as Kansas University HC is cringeworthy in the post game interviews now."

I hear the same thing in his voice, and I agree with you. Unfortunately, he is having to do "on the job training" for his position. IMO, the best we can hope for is to give him another 2-3 years, and hope that he grows into the position. Firing him after less than five years is a no-win situation.

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#2021669 - 10/13/17 09:40 AM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Kman_blue]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: moose1
Being this bad does nothing for recruiting. I am skeptical we hold on to the talented players that have given a verbal commitment. I just don't think a team can be this bad, and get players to play for them. I don't care how much they like the coach.
If I had to rank just how committed I think the top 3 guys are right now, I'd put them as Williams, Harris, then Jason from most committed to least committed.
Along this line of the thread, heard OU offered Williams recently. Also heard, Williams is still 100% solid with KU after the offer.

I've always thought this kid was the most solidly committed to KU from day 1 and it looks like that's still true.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2021671 - 10/13/17 09:53 AM Re: Unpopular message [Re: Yardbirdbob]
beenahawk Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 09/01/02
Loc: Topeka, Kansas
Originally Posted By: Yardbirdbob
Firing him after less than five years is a no-win situation.


Just this single sentence is quite telling! I sure hope there is no double meaning to it but, I also fear that retaining DB for five full years might just be a "no win situation"! sick

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