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#2021452 - 10/07/17 07:34 PM 4th and 1
pizzanbeer Offline
Max Falkenstien

Registered: 07/03/09
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.



Edited by pizzanbeer (10/07/17 07:35 PM)

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#2021453 - 10/07/17 07:38 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: pizzanbeer]
track Offline
gale sayers

Registered: 01/18/06
Loc: Topeka,Kansas
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.


Maybe we just don’t have the horses up front to make a hole or a push forward. Seemed pretty clear they just pushed our guys around.

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#2021461 - 10/07/17 09:29 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: pizzanbeer]
INation Offline
Thunderhawk

Registered: 09/20/14
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.



It's because they had the RB 7 yards behind the line of scrimmage. A QB sneak would have had a better chance.

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#2021469 - 10/07/17 11:13 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: INation]
KUCO_VOC Offline
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
Originally Posted By: INation
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.



It's because they had the RB 7 yards behind the line of scrimmage. A QB sneak would have had a better chance.
Beaty hates Stanley.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2021471 - 10/08/17 10:02 AM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: KUCO_VOC]
58hawk Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 12/16/09
Loc: KCMO
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
Originally Posted By: INation
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.



It's because they had the RB 7 yards behind the line of scrimmage. A QB sneak would have had a better chance.
Beaty hates Stanley.
Source?
_________________________
KU Coach Naismith invented the game so you get to play it.

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#2021472 - 10/08/17 10:17 AM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: 58hawk]
KUCO_VOC Offline
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
Originally Posted By: 58hawk
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
Originally Posted By: INation
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.



It's because they had the RB 7 yards behind the line of scrimmage. A QB sneak would have had a better chance.
Beaty hates Stanley.
Source?
It’s reliable but unnamed. Says Ken hates Barbie as well. 😂
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2021475 - 10/08/17 12:09 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: track]
Kman_blue Online   content
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: track
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
We turned the ball over on downs on our first 2 drives because we could not gain 1 yard on 4th down. As I recall Herbert got stuffed trying to run up the middle on the first attempt and then he got stuffed trying to run outside on the second attempt. Between Beaty, Meacham, Hull and Yenser it is hard to understand how they cannot figure out a reliable running play for those situations.


Maybe we just don’t have the horses up front to make a hole or a push forward. Seemed pretty clear they just pushed our guys around.
We've got the horses to get 1 yard against their D. We just didn't do it. QB sneak with Stanley would have worked or take the snap under center and run it right behind Tovi. Kid is big and strong enough to have pushed h is guy back a yard.

Don't know what's happened with our OL. I watched our All-conference guy in Adeniji just get blown up several times. Watched him just get his ass kicked a few times too and I don't recall that every happening last year when he weighed 30lbs less and was a true Freshman.

This team has gone soft in a big way. Softer than they ever were last year even IMHO. Don't know what the hell's going on in practice or S&C wise, but this team has regressed in the toughness department in a big way. Doesn't make sense to me and I didn't see this type of thing coming. A bunch of our guys are a lot better than they've been playing.

That's probably the most disappointing thing to me about this year's team is how soft they've played and how they don't seem to be playing with an edge at all like they did the last 4 games of last year. Well, that and the lack of preparedness they seem to have. It's worse than last year as well IMO. Not sure how that happens even if you were trying to make it happen.

Being absolutely snake bit by the injury bug isn't helping anything along either. I mean, what are we down 6 guys from year ending injuries/health problems now? Herbert finally breaks a big run and is gonna go all the way, but right after he breaks into the clear he pulls his hamstring.

Probably as many or more guys mysteriously aren't playing who should be too. Our best DB has his best game against WVU and he suddenly sits this one out supposedly with mono, but he looks healthy and not sick behind the bench. A couple more guys don't even dress for no public reason. I mean, this team is cursed.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2021481 - 10/08/17 06:03 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: pizzanbeer]
KUCO_VOC Offline
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
So it takes this long for kman to believe what I have known about the HS HC Beaty. He is not qualified.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2021482 - 10/08/17 06:24 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: Kman_blue]
pizzanbeer Offline
Max Falkenstien

Registered: 07/03/09
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
We've got the horses to get 1 yard against their D. We just didn't do it. QB sneak with Stanley would have worked or take the snap under center and run it right behind Tovi. Kid is big and strong enough to have pushed h is guy back a yard.


They must be worried that Bender won't be able to handle a snap under center or that Ribordy will get pushed back into the play or that the handoff to the RB will get fumbled.

I would like to see them just use a wildcat formation and hike it directly to a RB on 4th and 1 or use a QB sneak behind Ribordy and Tovi. I also would like to see Meacham use a jumbo package where we bring in our biggest OL players and double TEs for run blocking. I also would like to see Beaty recruit a bigger RB that is harder to tackle for short yardage situations. I am talking about a Brandon McAnderson size 235 lb RB.

Beaty wants to run it on 4th and 1 but it does not look like he has recruited the correct players on OL and RB for those type of plays. Yenser continues to recruit primarily light weight OL players that are good at pass blocking when they can give up ground to block but are not big enough or strong enough to exert their will and push DL players out of the way on 4th and 1. What I am talking about are 350 lb OL players that we use as short yardage specialists. If Yenser wants to use lighter OTs on pass plays to dance with DEs then that is fine but he needs to bring in bigger OL players for short yardage running plays that have the size and strength to push the DL backwards. The RBs that Beaty recruits are small and shifty but lack the size to be effective in short yardage plays. Beaty needs to add a bigger power RB in this recruiting class. With Herbert and Martin both injured I am not sure that smaller RBs are even durable enough for the kind of punishing tackles that are regular in the Big 12.


Edited by pizzanbeer (10/08/17 07:00 PM)

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#2021483 - 10/08/17 07:39 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: pizzanbeer]
Jman1 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 12/12/03
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
We've got the horses to get 1 yard against their D. We just didn't do it. QB sneak with Stanley would have worked or take the snap under center and run it right behind Tovi. Kid is big and strong enough to have pushed h is guy back a yard.


They must be worried that Bender won't be able to handle a snap under center or that Ribordy will get pushed back into the play or that the handoff to the RB will get fumbled.

I would like to see them just use a wildcat formation and hike it directly to a RB on 4th and 1 or use a QB sneak behind Ribordy and Tovi. I also would like to see Meacham use a jumbo package where we bring in our biggest OL players and double TEs for run blocking. I also would like to see Beaty recruit a bigger RB that is harder to tackle for short yardage situations. I am talking about a Brandon McAnderson size 235 lb RB.

Beaty wants to run it on 4th and 1 but it does not look like he has recruited the correct players on OL and RB for those type of plays. Yenser continues to recruit primarily light weight OL players that are good at pass blocking when they can give up ground to block but are not big enough or strong enough to exert their will and push DL players out of the way on 4th and 1. What I am talking about are 350 lb OL players that we use as short yardage specialists. If Yenser wants to use lighter OTs on pass plays to dance with DEs then that is fine but he needs to bring in bigger OL players for short yardage running plays that have the size and strength to push the DL backwards. The RBs that Beaty recruits are small and shifty but lack the size to be effective in short yardage plays. Beaty needs to add a bigger power RB in this recruiting class. With Herbert and Martin both injured I am not sure that smaller RBs are even durable enough for the kind of punishing tackles that are regular in the Big 12.


You are asking quite a bit from The Three Stooges, Barney Fife and The Pointer Sisters. Concentrate on just keeping the opponent under 50 at this point, and hope and pray a bolt of lightning strikes the stadium so it is unusable for the next 3-4 years

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#2021489 - 10/08/17 08:45 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: pizzanbeer]
Kman_blue Online   content
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
To be fair, I think what their strategy on recruiting OL is recruit athletic big guys who may not be at the weight you'd like, but are quick and athletic. Guys with the size and the frame to add bulk to get to the weight you want OL at, but good weight you can put on them through your S&C and dietary programs while maintaining their athleticism.

I don't believe they think these guys won't eventually be strong enough to be able to run block when needed, but rather they'll be quick and athletic enough to deal with fast pass rushing DE's as well as be able to pull on a sweep or power play.

If you recruit big ole 350lbs guys who can't move, which is what you'll get unless you're a blue blood football school because all of the 350lbs. OL who are still quick and athletic go to those schools, then you'll get a line that is woefully deficient on pass blocking and probably won't be effect run blocking on plays where they're asked to get to the 2nd level and block a LB.

Like I said, I think we've got enough big guys who are strong enough to run block for a 1 yard gain. What I don't get is how a guy like Adeniji who was maybe the most impressive true Freshman OL I've ever seen at KU or maybe anywhere in the Big 12 adds 30lbs. - 35lbs. and then gets his ass handed to him by a guy he dominated last year. And I don't think the other guy improved that much, but rather Adeniji looks like he's regressed all of a sudden. I didn't think you could make a guy like Adeniji look that much worse if you were actually trying to do that, much less trying to improve him. At worst I'd think he would just look about the same as last year. Same thing can be said about several guys on this team.

Not trying to pick on Adeniji as he hasn't at all been bad all year or anything. He did play well in at least 2 of our games, just not this past one. He's more of a microcosm of what's happening with this team. It's like they've lost something on the psychological side of the game. Lost mental toughness and maybe confidence too? They just don't look mentally prepared.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2021490 - 10/08/17 08:54 PM Re: 4th and 1 [Re: Jman1]
Kman_blue Online   content
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: Jman1
You are asking quite a bit from The Three Stooges, Barney Fife and The Pointer Sisters. Concentrate on just keeping the opponent under 50 at this point, and hope and pray a bolt of lightning strikes the stadium so it is unusable for the next 3-4 years
Now why you got to bring The Pointer Sisters into this?


Man, you been all over this sh|it.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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