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#2020384 - 09/11/17 06:56 AM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: PbBut]
moose1 Offline
Max Falkenstien

Registered: 12/29/06
Loc: Wichita
Originally Posted By: PbBut


Air Raid is one thing, but every time we tried to speed up the action to catch CMU off guard, it invariably was a wasted play. Let's try to do the basics before we try the exceptional. It's like giving a freshman a scalpel and start teaching him neurosurgery on Day 1.


I hate that KU is using the Air Raid offense. With KUs lack of depth and experience it makes no sense to speed things up. KU should take their time and try to do things right. They also should be making the game shorter not longer.

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#2020385 - 09/11/17 09:02 AM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: moose1]
Magicman Offline
Prairie Warrior

Registered: 10/07/13
Whatever offense we run, you have to block. I saw very little of that on Saturday! I can only think of a couple times where I thought, Bender, hung on to the ball to long. I'm sure that most of the O-line had their problems, but it seems like Frazier and Rhodes had the most. The secondary was really bad and having no pass rush didn't help them any. The good thing is, I can't believe it can get worse than Saturday.


Edited by Magicman (09/11/17 09:08 AM)

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#2020386 - 09/11/17 09:18 AM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: pizzanbeer]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
Kman, we rely on you to bring a little more sunshine in your post game analysis.
Sorry to disappoint on this one, but there just wasn't much at all to be positive about in this one.

The 2 drives coming out of half time were the 2 best drives of the year though, so I guess we've got that going for us. Maybe we found some things on O we're really good at with those 2 drives.

My game analysis may have been influenced by my feelings after game 1 a bit. I had a bad feeling after the SEMO game despite us winning and it got reinforced after this one. Hopefully Ohio sticks to their M.O. on offense and we find a way to still score on their D. If that happens we've got a fighting chance I think. If Ohio comes out running a bunch of different sets on O and passing more then I think we'll be lucky to hang with them.



Maybe this part is for another thread, but here it goes anyway.

My biggest disappointment has been our line play so far on both sides of the ball and I agree with Bigdogjac that winning in the trenches can cover up a lot of other stuff. We haven't been winning in the trenches at all so far this year except on passing plays against SEMO. And as I refuse to believe our talent on the lines is inferior to SEMO or CMU, despite our being thin at DT, then I'm lead to believe we've got coaching problems and/or mental problems(making the right reads, knowing the blocking schemes called, playing with high energy on every down, etc.) at both position groups.

I watched the CMU - Rhode Island game and RI's DL had their way with the CMU OL for much of that game. I will say RI had some good DL(they looked a lot better than last year), but so does KU and we got handled fairly well by CMU's OL for the most part. CMU's DL played well against RI's OL, but not as well as they played against ours and it looked clear to me that KU has a lot more talent on OL than RI does. I didn't watch the Dayton - SEMO game, so I couldn't tell you how SEMO's lines looked against them compared to us but I'd like to think KU also has more talent on both lines than Dayton does and hence SEMO's lines didn't do as well against us as they did against Dayton.

In a way I might give them a pass at the RT position in that it looks obvious to me that Frazier just isn't ready to be a starter yet. He's too young and inexperienced and not physically where he needs to be yet. You could say the coaches had no way of knowing that for sure until he got into real game situations, but now it should be obvious and if they keep starting him then it's on them or they believe we've got absolutely nobody else who can play there at any sort of competent level which is a scary thought.

Bottom line though, until we get things fixed on both lines and find the right groups of guys to start on both lines we're gonna struggle. Both OG spots need to be reshuffled as well as the RT spot(start Baldwin!) IMHO. If Armstrong keeps getting double teamed on every play and even triple teamed on some as he has so far, everyone else on the DL HAS TO STEP UP and make plays to counter that. Wise does sometimes, but so far nobody else has on any kind of consistent basis.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2020387 - 09/11/17 10:00 AM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
KUCO_VOC Online   happy
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
Kman, we rely on you to bring a little more sunshine in your post game analysis.
Sorry to disappoint on this one, but there just wasn't much at all to be positive about in this one.

The 2 drives coming out of half time were the 2 best drives of the year though, so I guess we've got that going for us. Maybe we found some things on O we're really good at with those 2 drives.

My game analysis may have been influenced by my feelings after game 1 a bit. I had a bad feeling after the SEMO game despite us winning and it got reinforced after this one. Hopefully Ohio sticks to their M.O. on offense and we find a way to still score on their D. If that happens we've got a fighting chance I think. If Ohio comes out running a bunch of different sets on O and passing more then I think we'll be lucky to hang with them.



Maybe this part is for another thread, but here it goes anyway.

My biggest disappointment has been our line play so far on both sides of the ball and I agree with Bigdogjac that winning in the trenches can cover up a lot of other stuff. We haven't been winning in the trenches at all so far this year except on passing plays against SEMO. And as I refuse to believe our talent on the lines is inferior to SEMO or CMU, despite our being thin at DT, then I'm lead to believe we've got coaching problems and/or mental problems(making the right reads, knowing the blocking schemes called, playing with high energy on every down, etc.) at both position groups.

I watched the CMU - Rhode Island game and RI's DL had their way with the CMU OL for much of that game. I will say RI had some good DL(they looked a lot better than last year), but so does KU and we got handled fairly well by CMU's OL for the most part. CMU's DL played well against RI's OL, but not as well as they played against ours and it looked clear to me that KU has a lot more talent on OL than RI does. I didn't watch the Dayton - SEMO game, so I couldn't tell you how SEMO's lines looked against them compared to us but I'd like to think KU also has more talent on both lines than Dayton does and hence SEMO's lines didn't do as well against us as they did against Dayton.

In a way I might give them a pass at the RT position in that it looks obvious to me that Frazier just isn't ready to be a starter yet. He's too young and inexperienced and not physically where he needs to be yet. You could say the coaches had no way of knowing that for sure until he got into real game situations, but now it should be obvious and if they keep starting him then it's on them or they believe we've got absolutely nobody else who can play there at any sort of competent level which is a scary thought.

Bottom line though, until we get things fixed on both lines and find the right groups of guys to start on both lines we're gonna struggle. Both OG spots need to be reshuffled as well as the RT spot(start Baldwin!) IMHO. If Armstrong keeps getting double teamed on every play and even triple teamed on some as he has so far, everyone else on the DL HAS TO STEP UP and make plays to counter that. Wise does sometimes, but so far nobody else has on any kind of consistent basis.
I'm the sunshine-pumper now.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2020389 - 09/11/17 10:48 AM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
track Offline
gale sayers

Registered: 01/18/06
Loc: Topeka,Kansas
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
Kman, we rely on you to bring a little more sunshine in your post game analysis.
Sorry to disappoint on this one, but there just wasn't much at all to be positive about in this one.

The 2 drives coming out of half time were the 2 best drives of the year though, so I guess we've got that going for us. Maybe we found some things on O we're really good at with those 2 drives.

My game analysis may have been influenced by my feelings after game 1 a bit. I had a bad feeling after the SEMO game despite us winning and it got reinforced after this one. Hopefully Ohio sticks to their M.O. on offense and we find a way to still score on their D. If that happens we've got a fighting chance I think. If Ohio comes out running a bunch of different sets on O and passing more then I think we'll be lucky to hang with them.



Maybe this part is for another thread, but here it goes anyway.

My biggest disappointment has been our line play so far on both sides of the ball and I agree with Bigdogjac that winning in the trenches can cover up a lot of other stuff. We haven't been winning in the trenches at all so far this year except on passing plays against SEMO. And as I refuse to believe our talent on the lines is inferior to SEMO or CMU, despite our being thin at DT, then I'm lead to believe we've got coaching problems and/or mental problems(making the right reads, knowing the blocking schemes called, playing with high energy on every down, etc.) at both position groups.

I watched the CMU - Rhode Island game and RI's DL had their way with the CMU OL for much of that game. I will say RI had some good DL(they looked a lot better than last year), but so does KU and we got handled fairly well by CMU's OL for the most part. CMU's DL played well against RI's OL, but not as well as they played against ours and it looked clear to me that KU has a lot more talent on OL than RI does. I didn't watch the Dayton - SEMO game, so I couldn't tell you how SEMO's lines looked against them compared to us but I'd like to think KU also has more talent on both lines than Dayton does and hence SEMO's lines didn't do as well against us as they did against Dayton.

In a way I might give them a pass at the RT position in that it looks obvious to me that Frazier just isn't ready to be a starter yet. He's too young and inexperienced and not physically where he needs to be yet. You could say the coaches had no way of knowing that for sure until he got into real game situations, but now it should be obvious and if they keep starting him then it's on them or they believe we've got absolutely nobody else who can play there at any sort of competent level which is a scary thought.

Bottom line though, until we get things fixed on both lines and find the right groups of guys to start on both lines we're gonna struggle. Both OG spots need to be reshuffled as well as the RT spot(start Baldwin!) IMHO. If Armstrong keeps getting double teamed on every play and even triple teamed on some as he has so far, everyone else on the DL HAS TO STEP UP and make plays to counter that. Wise does sometimes, but so far nobody else has on any kind of consistent basis.
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
Kman, we rely on you to bring a little more sunshine in your post game analysis.
Sorry to disappoint on this one, but there just wasn't much at all to be positive about in this one.

The 2 drives coming out of half time were the 2 best drives of the year though, so I guess we've got that going for us. Maybe we found some things on O we're really good at with those 2 drives.

My game analysis may have been influenced by my feelings after game 1 a bit. I had a bad feeling after the SEMO game despite us winning and it got reinforced after this one. Hopefully Ohio sticks to their M.O. on offense and we find a way to still score on their D. If that happens we've got a fighting chance I think. If Ohio comes out running a bunch of different sets on O and passing more then I think we'll be lucky to hang with them.



Maybe this part is for another thread, but here it goes anyway.

My biggest disappointment has been our line play so far on both sides of the ball and I agree with Bigdogjac that winning in the trenches can cover up a lot of other stuff. We haven't been winning in the trenches at all so far this year except on passing plays against SEMO. And as I refuse to believe our talent on the lines is inferior to SEMO or CMU, despite our being thin at DT, then I'm lead to believe we've got coaching problems and/or mental problems(making the right reads, knowing the blocking schemes called, playing with high energy on every down, etc.) at both position groups.

I watched the CMU - Rhode Island game and RI's DL had their way with the CMU OL for much of that game. I will say RI had some good DL(they looked a lot better than last year), but so does KU and we got handled fairly well by CMU's OL for the most part. CMU's DL played well against RI's OL, but not as well as they played against ours and it looked clear to me that KU has a lot more talent on OL than RI does. I didn't watch the Dayton - SEMO game, so I couldn't tell you how SEMO's lines looked against them compared to us but I'd like to think KU also has more talent on both lines than Dayton does and hence SEMO's lines didn't do as well against us as they did against Dayton.

In a way I might give them a pass at the RT position in that it looks obvious to me that Frazier just isn't ready to be a starter yet. He's too young and inexperienced and not physically where he needs to be yet. You could say the coaches had no way of knowing that for sure until he got into real game situations, but now it should be obvious and if they keep starting him then it's on them or they believe we've got absolutely nobody else who can play there at any sort of competent level which is a scary thought.

Bottom line though, until we get things fixed on both lines and find the right groups of guys to start on both lines we're gonna struggle. Both OG spots need to be reshuffled as well as the RT spot(start Baldwin!) IMHO. If Armstrong keeps getting double teamed on every play and even triple teamed on some as he has so far, everyone else on the DL HAS TO STEP UP and make plays to counter that. Wise does sometimes, but so far nobody else has on any kind of consistent basis.
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: pizzanbeer
Kman, we rely on you to bring a little more sunshine in your post game analysis.
Sorry to disappoint on this one, but there just wasn't much at all to be positive about in this one.

The 2 drives coming out of half time were the 2 best drives of the year though, so I guess we've got that going for us. Maybe we found some things on O we're really good at with those 2 drives.

My game analysis may have been influenced by my feelings after game 1 a bit. I had a bad feeling after the SEMO game despite us winning and it got reinforced after this one. Hopefully Ohio sticks to their M.O. on offense and we find a way to still score on their D. If that happens we've got a fighting chance I think. If Ohio comes out running a bunch of different sets on O and passing more then I think we'll be lucky to hang with them.



Maybe this part is for another thread, but here it goes anyway.

My biggest disappointment has been our line play so far on both sides of the ball and I agree with Bigdogjac that winning in the trenches can cover up a lot of other stuff. We haven't been winning in the trenches at all so far this year except on passing plays against SEMO. And as I refuse to believe our talent on the lines is inferior to SEMO or CMU, despite our being thin at DT, then I'm lead to believe we've got coaching problems and/or mental problems(making the right reads, knowing the blocking schemes called, playing with high energy on every down, etc.) at both position groups.

I watched the CMU - Rhode Island game and RI's DL had their way with the CMU OL for much of that game. I will say RI had some good DL(they looked a lot better than last year), but so does KU and we got handled fairly well by CMU's OL for the most part. CMU's DL played well against RI's OL, but not as well as they played against ours and it looked clear to me that KU has a lot more talent on OL than RI does. I didn't watch the Dayton - SEMO game, so I couldn't tell you how SEMO's lines looked against them compared to us but I'd like to think KU also has more talent on both lines than Dayton does and hence SEMO's lines didn't do as well against us as they did against Dayton.

In a way I might give them a pass at the RT position in that it looks obvious to me that Frazier just isn't ready to be a starter yet. He's too young and inexperienced and not physically where he needs to be yet. You could say the coaches had no way of knowing that for sure until he got into real game situations, but now it should be obvious and if they keep starting him then it's on them or they believe we've got absolutely nobody else who can play there at any sort of competent level which is a scary thought.

Bottom line though, until we get things fixed on both lines and find the right groups of guys to start on both lines we're gonna struggle. Both OG spots need to be reshuffled as well as the RT spot(start Baldwin!) IMHO. If Armstrong keeps getting double teamed on every play and even triple teamed on some as he has so far, everyone else on the DL HAS TO STEP UP and make plays to counter that. Wise does sometimes, but so far nobody else has on any kind of consistent basis.

Let's not forget central Michigan beat OSU last year. ... they have talented athletes.
I rewatched the game last night. Yea , we sucked along the lines... including Armstrong at times but their QB threw a bunch of strikes at their receivers. He was very accurate. We have to put more pressure on the opposing QB to protect or inexperienced DBs if we want to stop anyone.


Edited by track (09/11/17 10:49 AM)

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#2020398 - 09/11/17 01:14 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: track]
Kman_blue Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 08/31/08
Loc: Kansas
Originally Posted By: track

Let's not forget central Michigan beat OSU last year. ... they have talented athletes.
I rewatched the game last night. Yea , we sucked along the lines... including Armstrong at times but their QB threw a bunch of strikes at their receivers. He was very accurate. We have to put more pressure on the opposing QB to protect or inexperienced DBs if we want to stop anyone.
Yeah, they aren't/weren't a bunch of no talent chumps or anything, but they did lose something like half of their starters from last year and are breaking in a brand new O. Our D just played way too poorly.

I might rewatch part of the game again later, as I think we also suffered from CMU just being a bad matchup for us. Our probable best positional group is WR and theirs is DB. Our worst positional group is probably DB and they ran a pass first type spread O as their new O. Just a bad matchup and that could have played a part in the game going the way it did.

Still no excuse for our poor play, but just a thought after thinking about it some more.
_________________________
"If I went West, I think I would go to Kansas." -Abraham Lincoln

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#2020401 - 09/11/17 02:25 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
track Offline
gale sayers

Registered: 01/18/06
Loc: Topeka,Kansas
Originally Posted By: Kman_blue
Originally Posted By: track

Let's not forget central Michigan beat OSU last year. ... they have talented athletes.
I rewatched the game last night. Yea , we sucked along the lines... including Armstrong at times but their QB threw a bunch of strikes at their receivers. He was very accurate. We have to put more pressure on the opposing QB to protect or inexperienced DBs if we want to stop anyone.
Yeah, they aren't/weren't a bunch of no talent chumps or anything, but they did lose something like half of their starters from last year and are breaking in a brand new O. Our D just played way too poorly.

I might rewatch part of the game again later, as I think we also suffered from CMU just being a bad matchup for us. Our probable best positional group is WR and theirs is DB. Our worst positional group is probably DB and they ran a pass first type spread O as their new O. Just a bad matchup and that could have played a part in the game going the way it did.

Still no excuse for our poor play, but just a thought after thinking about it some more.

They may have graduated a bunch from last year but this years offensive line is heavily dominated by seniors....and that QB can flat throw the ball on target. I would trade offensive lines and QB with them in a heartbeat.

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#2020403 - 09/11/17 03:37 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
KUCO_VOC Online   happy
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
If we don't recruit BG12 level, coach at BG12 level and don't develop BG12 level players perhaps we need to start with a better staff and HC? Just a thought...
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2020406 - 09/11/17 03:55 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
bigdogjac Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 05/11/10
Loc: Oklahoma
I'm the sunshine-pumper now. Kuco you actually made me laugh, then you just couldn't keep it up on your next post.
_________________________
Tomorrow may be too late--Live Today!

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#2020408 - 09/11/17 04:03 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
bigdogjac Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 05/11/10
Loc: Oklahoma
Morris was impressive. He threw a real fastball and hit the catchers glove most every time.

One thing I noticed about our hurry up offense is that we took the play down to the last few seconds every time. Not sure what that was all about. Were we starting to panic!
_________________________
Tomorrow may be too late--Live Today!

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#2020409 - 09/11/17 04:04 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: bigdogjac]
KUCO_VOC Online   happy
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
Originally Posted By: bigdogjac
I'm the sunshine-pumper now. Kuco you actually made me laugh, then you just couldn't keep it up on your next post.
Glad you asked! Dgless21 disappeared, kman has been doom & gloom, so sure I'm the current pumper of a ray of sunshine.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2020410 - 09/11/17 04:06 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
KUCO_VOC Online   happy
KU1980

Registered: 05/22/08
Loc: Denver, CO
The latest game confirmed what I have said all along about the HS coach. Not ready for prime time.
_________________________
Kansas football will rise again (Coach Don Fambrough style)

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#2020412 - 09/11/17 04:47 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: Kman_blue]
kylecof11 Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 07/20/09
Loc: Kansas
I saw this mentioned somewhere else. But as bad as this team was through the first half, it was still just a 4 point game in the 3rd quarter. With a ton of momentum and balance both running and passing.

And then the defense just forgot how to play, tackle, etc.

That shows that they have some sort of resilience, and as kman mentioned, those 2 drives in the 3rd quarter were the best drives the offense had all year.

But still a disappointing showing. No doubt. And these kind of games will happen until KU football is ready to make the next leap. They'll show flashes, but they still aren't ready for the big leap yet. They will get there as this team is still very young and very raw in a lot of areas, but they will get there. It just is unknown when they will get there.

I expect a much different team vs Ohio this week. This team got a wake up call that they can't just show up and beat a team that barely squeaked by a FCS team. They have to show up every single week. They will not have fun practices on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Woodfin is going to ride their a** as is Beaty and the entire staff.

And health is an issue at the moment. The top 2 WR this program has didn't play much because of injury in Sims and Charlot. Taylor Martin went all camp with a knee brace on, then in the opener did not wear one and the result is a tweaked knee.

Armstrong just doesn't seem himself and neither does Loneker. Lee and Dineen are the only guys who have showed up consistently on that side of the ball.
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#2020414 - 09/11/17 05:12 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: kylecof11]
track Offline
gale sayers

Registered: 01/18/06
Loc: Topeka,Kansas
Originally Posted By: kylecof11
I saw this mentioned somewhere else. But as bad as this team was through the first half, it was still just a 4 point game in the 3rd quarter. With a ton of momentum and balance both running and passing.

And then the defense just forgot how to play, tackle, etc.

That shows that they have some sort of resilience, and as kman mentioned, those 2 drives in the 3rd quarter were the best drives the offense had all year.

But still a disappointing showing. No doubt. And these kind of games will happen until KU football is ready to make the next leap. They'll show flashes, but they still aren't ready for the big leap yet. They will get there as this team is still very young and very raw in a lot of areas, but they will get there. It just is unknown when they will get there.

I expect a much different team vs Ohio this week. This team got a wake up call that they can't just show up and beat a team that barely squeaked by a FCS team. They have to show up every single week. They will not have fun practices on Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday. Woodfin is going to ride their a** as is Beaty and the entire staff.

And health is an issue at the moment. The top 2 WR this program has didn't play much because of injury in Sims and Charlot. Taylor Martin went all camp with a knee brace on, then in the opener did not wear one and the result is a tweaked knee.

Armstrong just doesn't seem himself and neither does Loneker. Lee and Dineen are the only guys who have showed up consistently on that side of the ball.

Good analysis and summary....worth repeating.

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#2020415 - 09/11/17 05:40 PM Re: The game we forgot to show up [Re: KUCO_VOC]
track Offline
gale sayers

Registered: 01/18/06
Loc: Topeka,Kansas
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
If we don't recruit BG12 level, coach at BG12 level and don't develop BG12 level players perhaps we need to start with a better staff and HC? Just a thought...
Originally Posted By: KUCO_VOC
If we don't recruit BG12 level, coach at BG12 level and don't develop BG12 level players perhaps we need to start with a better staff and HC? Just a thought...

We have mostly 2 and 3 star recruits with a couple of 4 star.... they need to become juniors and seniors with a redshirt year to be Difference makers... . same as many of the other big 12 teams. It takes 5 years for a recruit to be a redshirt senior. We are not even half way there under Beaty.


Edited by track (09/11/17 05:43 PM)

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