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#2016542 - 04/01/17 09:22 PM Congrats to a Great Coach
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
Congratulations to a great coach, Bill Self on making it in the Naismith Memorial Hall of Fame of Coaches.

Kansas has a proud list of coaches in this Hall of Fame:

James Naismith (as a contributor and namesake of & father of basketball)
Phog Allen (father of basketball coaching, played under Naismith)
Adolph Rupp (player under Allen)
Dean Smith (player under Allen)
Ralph Miller (player under Allen)
Larry Brown (coach at KU, played under Smith and an assistant)
Roy Williams (coach at KU, assistant under Smith)
John Calipari (assistant under Brown)
John McLendon (mentored by Naismith, father of fast break)
Bill Self (coach at KU, assistant under Brown, has the highest percentage of wins at KU of all coaches)

Five of our eight coaches are in this Hall of Fame! That's over half of our coaches. Doubt that any other school even comes close to that!


Edited by Jayhawk1952 (04/01/17 10:43 PM)

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#2016543 - 04/02/17 01:21 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
AlOerter Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 10/02/13
Coach Self has earned it as have the other great KU coaches. We have been extremely fortunate as KU fans.
_________________________
" I used to have power. Now old age is creeping up on me." Chief Dan George

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#2016572 - 04/03/17 09:29 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: AlOerter]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
Originally Posted By: AlOerter
Coach Self has earned it as have the other great KU coaches. We have been extremely fortunate as KU fans.


Yes, we have been extremely fortunate as KU fans concerning our coaches. We have also become extremely spoiled! My first 31 years as a fan we had a total of 6 losing seasons. My next 34 years, under 3 coaches, we've had 0 losing seasons. To have a losing season now would cause our fans to think that Armageddon had happened!

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#2016584 - 04/04/17 01:47 AM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Coach Self is the best mid-major coach in the history of basketball.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016585 - 04/04/17 01:48 AM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
...although he's only slightly better than Mark Few.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016609 - 04/04/17 04:56 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
The past 14 years Self has the highest winning percentage of any Div. I coach, .827. That includes all major universities. That certainly qualifies him as a top major basketball coach no matter what you may spew out.

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#2016612 - 04/04/17 05:40 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Originally Posted By: Jayhawk1952
The past 14 years Self has the highest winning percentage of any Div. I coach, .827. That includes all major universities. That certainly qualifies him as a top major basketball coach no matter what you may spew out.


lol

It's pretty easy to get a high win percentage if the competition sucks. Your farm logic is cute though.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016613 - 04/04/17 06:00 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
For JW, who has no logic, to say that Self is a great mid-major coach is really laughable. The following two tables give the percentage wins, first, for all games and, second, eliminating the mid-major records any had:

Coaches with top percentage of wins for all seasons with over 550 total wins to date from official NCAA records:
Rupp ........ .822 Started at Kentucky
Wooden .... .804 Two years at Indiana St. then UCLA
Williams ... .786 Started at Kansas
Tarkanian . .784 All in non major power conferences (3)
Smith ....... .776 Started at UNC
Calipari .... .773 UMass, Memphis, Kentucky
Self ......... .764 ORU, Tulsa, Illinois, Kansas (lst 2 rebuilders)
Coach K .. .764 Five years at Army then Duke
Shows Self and Coach K tied for 7th. All for ALL TIME!

Drop the mid-major schools that some of the coaches started out with and you get the following winning averages.

Rupp .......... .822 — All at UK
Self ............ .817 — Dropping ORU and Tulsa
Wooden ...... .808 — Dropping Ill. St.
Williams ..... .786 — All at KU and UNC
Coach K ..... .786 — Dropping Army
Tarkanian .... .784 — No changes made
Smith ......... .776 — All at UNC
Calipari ....... .773 — No changes made

That would put Self a number two, not far behind Rupp. Not bad for a coach who is only a great mid-major coach. Coach K ties Roy for 4th. Wooden didn't change much.

And as for tournament coaches, my other recent post clearly shows that Roy is the only one that has any possible edge over Self the past 14 years. The other four, Self, Cal, Coach K and Izzo all have very similar good and bad tourneys. If Self is a mid-major coach, then so are Cal, Coach K and Izzo.

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#2016614 - 04/04/17 07:07 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Originally Posted By: Jayhawk1952
For JW, who has no logic, to say that Self is a great mid-major coach is really laughable. The following two tables give the percentage wins, first, for all games and, second, eliminating the mid-major records any had:

Coaches with top percentage of wins for all seasons with over 550 total wins to date from official NCAA records:
Rupp ........ .822 Started at Kentucky
Wooden .... .804 Two years at Indiana St. then UCLA
Williams ... .786 Started at Kansas
Tarkanian . .784 All in non major power conferences (3)
Smith ....... .776 Started at UNC
Calipari .... .773 UMass, Memphis, Kentucky
Self ......... .764 ORU, Tulsa, Illinois, Kansas (lst 2 rebuilders)
Coach K .. .764 Five years at Army then Duke
Shows Self and Coach K tied for 7th. All for ALL TIME!

Drop the mid-major schools that some of the coaches started out with and you get the following winning averages.

Rupp .......... .822 — All at UK
Self ............ .817 — Dropping ORU and Tulsa
Wooden ...... .808 — Dropping Ill. St.
Williams ..... .786 — All at KU and UNC
Coach K ..... .786 — Dropping Army
Tarkanian .... .784 — No changes made
Smith ......... .776 — All at UNC
Calipari ....... .773 — No changes made

That would put Self a number two, not far behind Rupp. Not bad for a coach who is only a great mid-major coach. Coach K ties Roy for 4th. Wooden didn't change much.

And as for tournament coaches, my other recent post clearly shows that Roy is the only one that has any possible edge over Self the past 14 years. The other four, Self, Cal, Coach K and Izzo all have very similar good and bad tourneys. If Self is a mid-major coach, then so are Cal, Coach K and Izzo.


lol again

Your farm brain just doesn't understand basic English. Let me break it down for you.

The point is that WINNING PERCENTAGE DOESN'T MATTER. Why? Because we have a premise that the Big 12 is nothing more than a mid-major conference. OMG THE HORROR. It's a fact though. The Big 12 sucks and will continue to suck for eternity. KU needs to leave.

Bill Self is beating up on a ton of crappy schools, a la Gonzaga. I submit that the Big 12 is more akin to the WCC than it is to the ACC. So yeah, Bill Self has a great winning percentage. But who cares? He isn't playing anyone important. But, when he does finally get a chance to play a legitimate team...in the tournament...he loses. Again, and again. Meaning...wait for it...his regular season performance is causing his teams to be overrated because his regular seasons are against overrated competition.

Now, I know you will come back with some more meaningless "statistics." I prefer actual measures of success to meaningless crap though. Here are a few real metrics for you to try to wrap your infant brain around:

Sweet 16 berths
Final Four berths
National Championships

None of these are influenced by playing in a mid-major conference. Indeed, to make each of these plateaus requires BEATING REAL COMPETITION. Nothing that happens in the Big 12 is relevant. It is a crappy, dying conference. The fact that KU has won it 13 years in a row either proves that Bill Self is the greatest coach of all time...but he should have some more Final Four rings to show for this run if that were the case OR, correctly, that the Big 12 is an overrated mid-major conference and Bill Self, like Mark Few, has built a solid program to dominate it but can't similarly compete with major conference opponents.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016615 - 04/04/17 07:36 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
I'll keep it simple for you JW. Just because you say something is doesn't make it so. Your statement that the Big 12 is a mid-major conference is absolutely crazy. KU plays as strong a non-conference schedule as any of the schools, unless you call playing Kentucky and Duke mid-majors. According to your reasoning, maybe they are. No matter what statistics anyone sets forth, you are going to spin however you want it. So your opinion is worthless. Why don't you do us all a favor and just stay off of this board. You really don't have anything worthwhile to contribute.Have a good day.

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#2016616 - 04/04/17 07:46 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
PHOGUSHER Offline
Original AFH Gangsta

Registered: 11/01/05
Loc: Western Kansas Hinderlands
Jim is mad because now he has to be the Y performing YMCA at the Blue Oyster tonight. He has zero basketball insight..hairy balls is what he has experience with..cradling ..cradling.
_________________________
No more .net hate. Just here to share incredible special moments with my Jayhawk brethren.

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#2016617 - 04/04/17 09:12 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Originally Posted By: Jayhawk1952
I'll keep it simple for you JW. Just because you say something is doesn't make it so. Your statement that the Big 12 is a mid-major conference is absolutely crazy.


I've proven this before. It's what drove all the kusports.net people away...they couldn't handle my proof.

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KU plays as strong a non-conference schedule as any of the schools,


The preseason is irrelevant.

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unless you call playing Kentucky and Duke mid-majors.


lol red herring

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According to your reasoning, maybe they are.


Are you this dumb? You are conflating conferences with programs. All that corn husking has rotted your brain.

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No matter what statistics anyone sets forth, you are going to spin however you want it.


If the statistics are relevant and bias-free, false. Your "statistics" however, are cherry picked to support your conclusion. Your farm-bred lifestyle has never taught you how to remove bias and skew from your data. Sad.

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So your opinion is worthless.


My opinion is supported by fact and scientific proof. Therefore, my opinion is incontestable.

Quotes from JimWest can be found in footnotes of Nature articles.

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Why don't you do us all a favor and just stay off of this board.


Why? Because you can't handle facts that shatter your image of the GREAT DEITY BILL SELF? Sorry, we have passed through the Enlightenment and are now in the Age of Reason. I will topple your false Icons.

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You really don't have anything worthwhile to contribute.Have a good day.


Compared to your ethanol-fueled corruption of the natural environment? lol
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016619 - 04/05/17 05:02 AM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
jahawker2004 Offline
Freethinker

Registered: 12/30/03
Loc: Wherever Freethinkers Gather
I know you two are getting testy but--

This thread is an absolute delight!!!!

Lengthy, detailed posts And solid debate back and forth.

How refreshing!

And, of course, the Slickster gleefully sneers at the "farmers" and clueless peasants he so airily looks down upon.

What entertainment!

Here's my favorite--

"Quotes from JimWest can be found in footnotes of Nature articles."

Wow! He can really stuff a shirt, can't he? I laughed so hard my dentures flew across the room.

It don't get no better than this around here!
_________________________
"Those Places (UNC, UCLA) Are Great, But There's No Place Like Kansas"
---Larry Brown to Bill Self.

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#2016624 - 04/05/17 11:08 AM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
Maximus Offline
Wilt Chamberlain

Registered: 10/30/12
Loc: Trance Land
Should this thread merge with the other Bill Self thread?
_________________________
Your enemies will know your quality where ever you meet them.

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#2016652 - 04/06/17 12:30 AM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
Originally Posted By: JimWest
[quote=Jayhawk1952]I'll keep it simple for you JW. Just because you say something is doesn't make it so. Your statement that the Big 12 is a mid-major conference is absolutely crazy.


Quote:
=JimWest]I've proven this before. It's what drove all the kusports.net people away...they couldn't handle my proof
.

I don't believe you have proven anything, well at least about the Big 12 Conference. I think you have proven a lot about yourself. If it is your desire to drive people from this board, then you are way out of line. Anyone who takes pleasure and/or makes it their goal to drive people from this board should themselves be removed from it by the powers that govern it.

Anyone who desires to express their opinion, as long as it doesn't violate the board rules, should feel free to do so. We all understand that there is going to always be disagreement concerning opinion. We may even sometimes needle each other and perhaps get under someone's skin. But to belittle anyone by trying to demean them is out of line. I recently thought that JW was starting to turn over a new leaf, but apparently I was greatly mistaken.

Just let it be known that he isn't going to run me off of this board. I am a true, died in the wool Jayhawk fan. But I do have serious reservations about his fan hood or loyalty to our Hawks. I think he is a fan of himself and that's about as far as it goes.

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#2016658 - 04/06/17 11:48 AM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Originally Posted By: Jayhawk1952
I don't believe you have proven anything, well at least about the Big 12 Conference.


We all get it, you love the Truckstop 10 and can't handle the truth.

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I think you have proven a lot about yourself.


I am that I am.

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If it is your desire to drive people from this board, then you are way out of line.


lol

Go ahead and join the other worthless, mindless fanbois at the knock-off site.

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Anyone who takes pleasure and/or makes it their goal to drive people from this board should themselves be removed from it by the powers that govern it.


lol again

"Mommy, he said something I don't agree with, kick him out please."

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Anyone who desires to express their opinion, as long as it doesn't violate the board rules, should feel free to do so.


Wait, what? lol

Contradict much?

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We all understand that there is going to always be disagreement concerning opinion.


Did you have a stroke mid-post?

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We may even sometimes needle each other and perhaps get under someone's skin. But to belittle anyone by trying to demean them is out of line. I recently thought that JW was starting to turn over a new leaf, but apparently I was greatly mistaken.


JimWest is not here to make friends.

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Just let it be known that he isn't going to run me off of this board. I am a true, died in the wool Jayhawk fan.


Great! Now start posting something worthwhile instead of fanboi tripe.

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But I do have serious reservations about his fan hood or loyalty to our Hawks.


2 questions:

1) Why does this matter?
2) Someone who actually cares about the University is more willing to criticize it than someone who just wants to look cool wearing a KU t-shirt. Guess which camp you are in?

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I think he is a fan of himself and that's about as far as it goes.


Truth
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016661 - 04/06/17 01:41 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
Originally Posted By: JimWest
[quote=Jayhawk1952]I don't believe you have proven anything, well at least about the Big 12 Conference.


"We all get it, you love the Truckstop 10 and can't handle the truth."

All you have to offer is your biased opinion. I've at least shared a post showing how Jeff Sagarin rates the teams in the top six conferences. Other ratings are quite similar. The Big 12 ranked at the top at all levels of the ratings shown from top to bottom in the conferences. But I guess you have a hard time dealing with such things that disprove your opinions.

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I think you have proven a lot about yourself.


"I am that I am."

Yes, you just said a mouthful about yourself, and sadly, it is no news to anyone on this board.

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If it is your desire to drive people from this board, then you are way out of line.


"lol

Go ahead and join the other worthless, mindless fanbois at the knock-off site."

I consider no human worthless, you would do well to do the same.

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Anyone who takes pleasure and/or makes it their goal to drive people from this board should themselves be removed from it by the powers that govern it.


"lol again

"'Mommy, he said something I don't agree with, kick him out please.'"

Nothing was said in my comment about disagreeing with others. It has everything to do with taking pleasure in and making it a goal to drive people from this board. I never have such an attitude about anyone who disagrees with me. If everyone agreed with me on everything, then this would be a pretty sorry world. Disagreement can help bring improvement, if done in the right way.

Quote:
Anyone who desires to express their opinion, as long as it doesn't violate the board rules, should feel free to do so.


"Wait, what? lol

Contradict much?"

No contradiction. Learn to understand what you are reading.

Quote:
We all understand that there is going to always be disagreement concerning opinion.


"Did you have a stroke mid-post?"

Your comment is based on a great misunderstanding of what you read.

Quote:
We may even sometimes needle each other and perhaps get under someone's skin. But to belittle anyone by trying to demean them is out of line. I recently thought that JW was starting to turn over a new leaf, but apparently I was greatly mistaken.


"JimWest is not here to make friends."

One of the best things in life is to make friends, even with your enemies.

Quote:
Just let it be known that he isn't going to run me off of this board. I am a true, died in the wool Jayhawk fan.


"Great! Now start posting something worthwhile instead of fanboi tripe.

Based on various posts I've read, your opinion is vastly in the minority."

Quote:
But I do have serious reservations about his fan hood or loyalty to our Hawks.


"2 questions:

1) Why does this matter?
2) Someone who actually cares about the University is more willing to criticize it than someone who just wants to look cool wearing a KU t-shirt. Guess which camp you are in?"

(1) It matters because this is a Jayhawk fan board.
(2) Anyone who actually cares about something isn't always going to be a critic. If you can't say something good once in a while, then it is really a far stretch to say that you are a fan. I don't agree with everything Self, his players, or the University say or do and the same is true concerning other posters on this board. Like EVERYONE else,including me, you and everyone else on this board, we make mistakes. One of the things I really like about Self is that he can jump very hard on one of his players about something wrong he did and then in a few moments have his arm across his shoulders encouraging him. Criticism alone doesn't help anyone. I suspect your opinion as to what camp I'm in is dead wrong.

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I think he is a fan of himself and that's about as far as it goes.


"Truth"

That's about the most accurate statement you've ever made.


Edited by Jayhawk1952 (04/06/17 02:31 PM)

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#2016664 - 04/06/17 02:53 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
Originally Posted By: Jayhawk1952
All you have to offer is your biased opinion. I've at least shared a post showing how Jeff Sagarin rates the teams in the top six conferences. Other ratings are quite similar. The Big 12 ranked at the top at all levels of the ratings shown from top to bottom in the conferences. But I guess you have a hard time dealing with such things that disprove your opinions.


Sagarin is not a results-oriented metric and similarly non-predictive.

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Yes, you just said a mouthful about yourself, and sadly, it is no news to anyone on this board.


k

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I consider no human worthless, you would do well to do the same.


Why? So I can pretend my life has meaning while I waste away on the farm like you?

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Nothing was said in my comment about disagreeing with others. It has everything to do with taking pleasure in and making it a goal to drive people from this board. I never have such an attitude about anyone who disagrees with me. If everyone agreed with me on everything, then this would be a pretty sorry world. Disagreement can help bring improvement, if done in the right way.


lol

You did have a stroke.

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No contradiction. Learn to understand what you are reading.


Call the ambulance.

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Your comment is based on a great misunderstanding of what you read.


Next of kin too.

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One of the best things in life is to make friends, even with your enemies.


Thanks, Sun Tzu.

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Based on various posts I've read, your opinion is vastly in the minority.


Genius is always in the minority.

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(1) It matters because this is a Jayhawk fan board.


WOO WOO WOO FANBOI POLICE

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(2) Anyone who actually cares about something isn't always going to be a critic.


Right, once you care about something you are supposed to turn a blind eye! Yee Haw I lOVe COWS

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If you can't say something good once in a while, then it is really a far stretch to say that you are a fan.


Learn to read. Learn to think. Learn to breathe?

Is the ambulance there yet?

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I don't agree with everything Self, his players, or the University say or do and the same is true concerning other posters on this board.


But but but the GREAT DEITY BILL SELF is infallible!

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Like EVERYONE else,including me, you and everyone else on this board, we make mistakes. One of the things I really like about Self is that he can jump very hard on one of his players about something wrong he did and then in a few moments have his arm across his shoulders encouraging him.


Notice how you aren't pointing to a fault in the GREAT DEITY BILL SELF, but rather further deifying him.

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Criticism alone doesn't help anyone. I suspect your opinion as to what camp I'm in is dead wrong.


No, but fanboi blather is really helpful!

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That's about the most accurate statement you've ever made.


Everything I have ever said has been accurate and beyond contestation.
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

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#2016665 - 04/06/17 03:21 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
Some may think that it's great to live in such a world of delusion, but I'll pass on it.

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#2016666 - 04/06/17 03:43 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: Jayhawk1952]
JimWest Online   happy
))<>((

Registered: 11/29/12
_________________________
I'm the slickest they is
I'm the quickest they is
Did I say I'm the slickest they is?

Top
#2016667 - 04/06/17 04:00 PM Re: Congrats to a Great Coach [Re: JimWest]
Jayhawk1952 Offline
US Marshal, Kansas Territory

Registered: 01/18/08
Originally Posted By: JimWest


That is speaking of a problem of the 19th century. It is no longer an element to be concerned about in the 21st century on the Great Plains. But here is something you might ought to be concerned about in the 21st century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delusional_disorder

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