Manny Ramirez

Posted by: jammahawk

Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 07:56 AM

Why isn't Manny Ramirez receiving fastballs under his chin? I watched Ramirez launch a homer last night, stand in the batters box, walk about 10 steps down to first base, admiring his shot as if he just hit a walk off homer in game 7. Someone needs to remind him, him only made the score 7-3 Indians.
If I'm the Indians manager, I've already instructed my pitcher to through Mannys first pitch, chin level.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 08:04 AM

1) It's Manny being Manny
2) It's the playoffs... Why risk a suspension or a manager getting ejected in the game? It would easily start a brawl if it happened, so just a bad idea.
3) It's Manny.
Posted by: gquinn225

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 08:24 AM

Quote:

1) It's Manny being Manny
2) It's the playoffs... Why risk a suspension or a manager getting ejected in the game? It would easily start a brawl if it happened, so just a bad idea.
3) It's Manny.




<yawn>.

Congratulations jdavis. As much as I haven't ever gotten into with you, I want you to know that you have converted me into a hater of the Sox as well. And it has nothing to do with them as a team. It's the fans.

I know you think you eat, bleed, and sleep Red Sox. And you may. But you need to know that you phrase things in such a way that is only irritating. And yes, maybe that is what made me respond to this, but I can imagine that your propensity to seemingly spout of every thought in your head is going to cause more waves for you than not, especially on your choice of career paths. I could be completely off base, but whatever. Good luck. With such a one-dimensional vision of sports, I think you are going to need it.

For the record, line item #2 made sense. #1 and #3, either homer crap that I think you felt compelled to write, or you've watched ESPN too much, b/c that sounded like typical Bristol cliche.
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 08:48 AM

Quote:

Why isn't Manny Ramirez receiving fastballs under his chin? I watched Ramirez launch a homer last night, stand in the batters box, walk about 10 steps down to first base, admiring his shot as if he just hit a walk off homer in game 7. Someone needs to remind him, him only made the score 7-3 Indians.
If I'm the Indians manager, I've already instructed my pitcher to through Mannys first pitch, chin level.




Dumb idea. You can't risk getting someone suspended that is valuable to the team. If Manny wants to admire his shot that make the score 7-3, maybe he's just worrying about his stats instead of the team. Makes sense, since CoCo is his little bitch out in Center Field.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 08:53 AM

Quote:

Quote:

1) It's Manny being Manny
2) It's the playoffs... Why risk a suspension or a manager getting ejected in the game? It would easily start a brawl if it happened, so just a bad idea.
3) It's Manny.




<yawn>.

Congratulations jdavis. As much as I haven't ever gotten into with you, I want you to know that you have converted me into a hater of the Sox as well. And it has nothing to do with them as a team. It's the fans.

I know you think you eat, bleed, and sleep Red Sox. And you may. But you need to know that you phrase things in such a way that is only irritating. And yes, maybe that is what made me respond to this, but I can imagine that your propensity to seemingly spout of every thought in your head is going to cause more waves for you than not, especially on your choice of career paths. I could be completely off base, but whatever. Good luck. With such a one-dimensional vision of sports, I think you are going to need it.

For the record, line item #2 made sense. #1 and #3, either homer crap that I think you felt compelled to write, or you've watched ESPN too much, b/c that sounded like typical Bristol cliche.


I wasn't being serious... But that's how the Boston media justifies it.

See, you're too concerned to bash me to understand sarcasm.

As far as I'm concerned, Manny can do what he wants as he long as he produces. He has 24 (23?) postseason homeruns, which is a record.

He's still a Hall of Famer....
Posted by: larryb

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 08:54 AM

The Indian players should have pointed to the score board as he rounded the bases.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:02 AM

For crying out loud, just throw the ball inside. It's not Manny being Manny, it's Manny being a show boating a-hole. I guess maybe that is Manny.
Manny, you made it 7-3.
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:05 AM

Quote:

The Indian players should have pointed to the score board as he rounded the bases.




They're way too classy to do that. Plus they have too much respect for the guy because he's a former teammate.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:10 AM

I think that's part of it, too. That he's "sticking it to the Indians" for not resigning him. He may be still angry at them... You never know.

Manny does things that are wrong, but doesn't understand they're wrong. Should he have watched it? Maybe, should he have thrown his hands up in the air and watched it? No.

But I have to say my fav. pic of the playoffs so far is his walk off in game 2 and his hands are in the air along with everyone at Fenway...
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:13 AM

Quote:

I think that's part of it, too. That he's "sticking it to the Indians" for not resigning him. He may be still angry at them... You never know.

Manny does things that are wrong, but doesn't understand they're wrong. Should he have watched it? Maybe, should he have thrown his hands up in the air and watched it? No.

But I have to say my fav. pic of the playoffs so far is his walk off in game 2 and his hands are in the air along with everyone at Fenway...




The Indians aren't going to waste 30% of their money on one player. Especially one that refuses to play defense.
Posted by: Morgansraider

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:15 AM

In the field, Manny Ramirez reminds me of a Lonnie Smith with Multiple Sclerosis and 250 lbs of extra weight.
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:17 AM

Its just pathetic that a ball can be hit to his side of the gap and he lets it go by and CoCo fields it 5 feet behind him and throws it in. It's just plain laziness!
Posted by: larryb

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:28 AM



A picture is worth a thousand words. Manny is a Mike Vick fan? I happen to like Manny because he has personality. I do not like him when he acts like an ass. Last night he acted like an ass.

Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:59 AM

I hope he's not a Vick fan anymore...
Who cares if the guy acts like an ass? They're stil down 3-1 and he just looked dumb, but he's one of the best, if not the best hitter in post-season history.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:14 AM

I'm glad I'm done coaching little league baseball, I don't think I would have had the patience trying to convince kids to not act like Manny.
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:30 AM

Quote:

I'm glad I'm done coaching little league baseball, I don't think I would have had the patience trying to convince kids to not act like Manny.




Trust me it's not that hard. I helped coach a little league team that was 1 win away from making it into regions for the LLWS. These kids love the game and watch it all the time. Of course they want to mimic their favorite players, but they know when and how to celebrate.
Posted by: JHAWX75

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:31 AM

Quote:

Quote:






They're way too classy to do that. Plus they have too much respect for the guy because he's a former teammate.




If by "teammate" you mean Kenny Lofton then, uhhh...ok. In 2000 Manny's only "teammate" from this current team was Lofton so NONE of these current players give a squat about Manny and the Cleveland connection.

Manny should of had his chin removed along with a "get well" tattoo of Bud Selig's name right on the tip. I like the dude cause he is madd clutch but come on Predator, your down 7-3. Maybe the 3 hr's in a row had him juiced up, i dont know.

It's funny to see chowda'fan blow this off like Carl Spackler and say "it's no big deal", grab a Baby Ruth and enjoy. The chowd's have officially become like most Yankeefans.

Welcome, my little bundle of chowd's.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:35 AM

Go give yourself a curtain call JHAWKx
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:36 AM

"Manny should of had his chin removed along with a "get well" tattoo of Bud Selig's name right on the tip. I like the dude cause he is madd clutch but come on Predator, your down 7-3. Maybe the 3 hr's in a row had him juiced up, i dont know."

What is hitting him going to do honestly? All its going to do is piss him off, cause an ejection that could hurt the team during the WS if they make it. It's just going to make him want to celebrate more when he hits the next one off of them.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:42 AM

And might have caused him to be angry enough to hit one again....
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:44 AM

Quote:

And might have caused him to be angry enough to hit one again....


Also, starting a brawl versus the Red Sox when the Sox have looked dead since the 5th inning of game two isn't going to be exactly good. It could light a spark that leads to a 4 run rally in the following innings...

Fueling a barely kindling flame to the point of a blaze wasn't going to help the Indians win that game and/or the series.
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 10:59 AM

I played catcher for my HS Legion team since I was in 8th grade and I only told the pitcher to throw at the batter twice. Once because the kid hit me right in the helmet and the other time was because the kid was bitching about every call during the game. I just don't see the point in it. It's not very sportsmanlike and I regret throwing the middle finger down telling my 90 mph only fastball pitcher to bean the kid.
Posted by: JHAWX75

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 11:51 AM

Quote:

"Manny should of had his chin removed along with a "get well" tattoo of Bud Selig's name right on the tip. I like the dude cause he is madd clutch but come on Predator, your down 7-3. Maybe the 3 hr's in a row had him juiced up, i dont know."

What is hitting him going to do honestly? All its going to do is piss him off, cause an ejection that could hurt the team during the WS if they make it. It's just going to make him want to celebrate more when he hits the next one off of them.




You act like if he gets pissed that he's gonna go Balboa v. Drago all over again. Whatever, so be it.
Posted by: JHAWX75

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 11:54 AM

Quote:

Go give yourself a curtain call JHAWKx




Thanks, I shall.
Posted by: JHAWX75

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 11:56 AM

Quote:

And might have caused him to be angry enough to hit one again....




Must anger be your tool to prevail?

Welcome o'chowd's, welcome!
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 01:25 PM

Quote:

Quote:

And might have caused him to be angry enough to hit one again....




Must anger be your tool to prevail?

Welcome o'chowd's, welcome!


No, just look at the 2004 Red Sox..the brawl sparked their season.
Posted by: JHAWX75

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 02:21 PM

Oh, how the chowd's fire is so shallow.

How do you really know? It could of been Manny's fart in the 8th inning of that game that "blew" the doors down.

Sing it with me...."Sweeeeeeet chowdofmine" OhOHOHOHOHOH!!!!
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 02:57 PM

Ball, meet Manny's ear, Manny's ear, meet ball.
Posted by: hasbeen

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 04:30 PM

I love your reasoning, davis.

Hey, don't worry guys. Hitler was just being Hitler. It's fine.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 04:39 PM

Yeah because Manny is trying to exterminate a race...
Posted by: hasbeen

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 05:22 PM

Never said he was, douche.
Posted by: gquinn225

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 05:33 PM

Quote:

Never said he was, douche.




I really like it when the word douche is used in this context. Nice work hasbeen.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 05:37 PM

Laugh it up BW
Posted by: gquinn225

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 05:38 PM

If you are trying to hurt me with that, not gonna work. I've already admitted to that. Try coming up with some thought of your own, though, really.

My guess is that you really can't, though, b/c you truly do lack social interaction skills.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 06:40 PM

Quote:

I love your reasoning, davis.

Hey, don't worry guys. Hitler was just being Hitler. It's fine.




Well that's a relief to know.
Posted by: Hawk1990

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/17/07 09:19 PM

I found this thread late, but here's my two cents anyway...

All of the Manny-bashing strikes me as people finding an excuse to bitch, probably because they just don't like the guy. Manny Ramirez is not the first, nor will he be the last, baseball player to admire one of his home runs. Ken Griffey Jr., one of the more admired and revered baseball players ever, has strutted and watched every single home run he's ever hit, even when he sucked after moving to Cincy. The highly-praised, plucky, post-season machine known as Kenny Lofton ostentatiously flips his bat down after every WALK for God's sake.

Was it a strange situation for Manny to stop and admire his work? Absolutely. But, as everyone with a brain knows, Manny IS strange. And I don't mean quirky, "Manny Being Manny" HaHa strange, I mean STRANGE. He drives around in a '72 Caddy with uncashed $100,000 paychecks in the glove compartment. He has two sons both named Manny Jr. This is not a normal person.

If you don't like Manny, for any number of reasons, and choose to rag on his home run styling, be my guest. But then be consistent and call out every player who does something similar. Advocate a fastball to Lofton's dome sometime if that's your chosen brand of baseball justice.
Posted by: JHAWX75

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 08:18 AM

Quote:

I found this thread late, but here's my two cents anyway...

All of the Manny-bashing strikes me as people finding an excuse to bitch, probably because they just don't like the guy. Manny Ramirez is not the first, nor will he be the last, baseball player to admire one of his home runs. Ken Griffey Jr., one of the more admired and revered baseball players ever, has strutted and watched every single home run he's ever hit, even when he sucked after moving to Cincy. The highly-praised, plucky, post-season machine known as Kenny Lofton ostentatiously flips his bat down after every WALK for God's sake.

Was it a strange situation for Manny to stop and admire his work? Absolutely. But, as everyone with a brain knows, Manny IS strange. And I don't mean quirky, "Manny Being Manny" HaHa strange, I mean STRANGE. He drives around in a '72 Caddy with uncashed $100,000 paychecks in the glove compartment. He has two sons both named Manny Jr. This is not a normal person.

If you don't like Manny, for any number of reasons, and choose to rag on his home run styling, be my guest. But then be consistent and call out every player who does something similar. Advocate a fastball to Lofton's dome sometime if that's your chosen brand of baseball justice.






This thread isnt about Lofton or Griffey Jr., it's about Manuel Ramirez. And what he did in that game was down right dumb, not "strange" but dumb. Youkilis ran the bases. Ortiz ran the bases. And the Manny being Manny reference is about as stupid as the Ruth curse. Like he should get a special pass for doing foolish things.
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 08:50 AM

Something else interesting I saw this morning. On Mike and Mike in the Morning manny was quoted saying, "losing the ALCS wouldn't be the end of the world." Watch out for this stuff through out the day on ESPN/ESPNews. Sean Salisbury told a quick story that made Manny sound like he was actually decent. Manny met him and his son a couple of years ago I believe he said. About a year or even more later, Manny ran over, YES RAN over to Sean and his son at another game and actually remembered his son's name. Just kind of made Manny look good.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 09:19 AM

If Ken Griffey Jr. were playing the other night and flipped his bat and walked to first base, then yes, I would have started this thread ragging on him. But it wasn't Griffey, it was Manny being stupid.
Do you think pitchers like Bob Gibson or Don Drysdale would have put up with that garbage? They would have had Ramirez on his a$$ at the first opportunity. Something you don't see very often from the pu$$ies that try to pass themselves off as pitchers today.
This Manny being Manny is garbage, I couldn't care less how wierd he is off the field, just keep it off the field.
Posted by: Zhawk06

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 09:24 AM

Quote:

Quote:

The Indian players should have pointed to the score board as he rounded the bases.




They're way too classy to do that. Plus they have too much respect for the guy because he's a former teammate.




He's a former teammate of Kenny Lofton's...and that's it.
Posted by: larryb

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 10:51 AM

The great Manny Ramirez has spoken. And in Manny's World, it doesn't really matter much if the Red Sox rebound to win the AL Championship Series. "If it doesn't happen, who cares?" Ramirez said yesterday at Jacobs Field, breaking his usual silence around reporters. "There's always next year. It's not like it's the end of the world."

It is the "who cares"? quote that makes me feel Manny is a moron. Once again, I like the guy but he is about as sharp as a marble most of the time.

Who cares? How about the Red Sox fans? I suppose they haven't shown you they care?
Posted by: jayhawks14

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 10:55 AM

Quote:

Something else interesting I saw this morning. On Mike and Mike in the Morning manny was quoted saying, "losing the ALCS wouldn't be the end of the world." Watch out for this stuff through out the day on ESPN/ESPNews. Sean Salisbury told a quick story that made Manny sound like he was actually decent. Manny met him and his son a couple of years ago I believe he said. About a year or even more later, Manny ran over, YES RAN over to Sean and his son at another game and actually remembered his son's name. Just kind of made Manny look good.




Yes, I posted this already...
Posted by: Morgansraider

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 11:48 AM

And people wonder why I just can't bring myself to care about baseball anymore. I was raised on guys like George Brett. This is what passes for a star these days.
Posted by: chiknbut

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:14 PM


I agree with Manny, "who cares."

Who cares if the Red Sox come back and win the series. Who cares if he wants to admire his home run and show boat. But payback is a bitch. "Who cares" if you get plunked in the ass for being a showboat.

The best reasons, in order, to enjoy this world series are as follows:

1. Colorado Rockies (THE baseball story of the past decade).

2. No Yankees.

3. No Red Sox.

If Manny and the Red Sox were in the World Series, I wouldn't watch it. Even if I was pulling for the Rockies. Manny does not make the game fun. He brings us much sportsmanship to the game as any soccer player brings to their lame sport.

And as for the Indians fans being classy, sorry. While I like this Indians team, it's hard to like their fans. These are the same people who boo Jim Thome when he comes to the Jake.
Posted by: unburnt_orange

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:19 PM

The best reasons, in order, to enjoy this world series are as follows:

1. Colorado Rockies (THE baseball story of the past decade).

2. No Red Sox.

3. No Yankees.

The natural order of the universe has been restored.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:30 PM

You people talk too soon.

And I find it interesting people come in here bashing the Red Sox after they hadn't posted in the baseball board all year.
Posted by: gquinn225

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:40 PM

Quote:

You people talk too soon.

And I find it interesting people come in here bashing the Red Sox after they hadn't posted in the baseball board all year.




Come on....really.
Posted by: unburnt_orange

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:41 PM

I don't give a fig about baseball.

Yankees beat Red Sox. That's all.
Posted by: jayhwk01

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:44 PM

Quote:

You people talk too soon.

And I find it interesting people come in here bashing the Red Sox after they hadn't posted in the baseball board all year.




Well I have been posting on Bball board all season AND bashing the BoSox and Yankees from spring training on (especailly with all the DiceK overhype and ummm told you he was overrated for the $ he is getting) Anyhow, by your standard I guess I qualify as a guy who has been here the whole season so here is the deal.....BoSox are cooked and thank god for it. See you next year Manny and Company. GO ROCKIES AND INDIANS!
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:56 PM

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/teamstats/roster.php?y=2004&t=BOS

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/playoffs04/1986_playoffs/alcs_game5/
Posted by: jayhwk01

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 01:59 PM

Yeah thanks for the roster from 2004 and 1986. Not sure what it proves but I am pretty sure Dave Henderson is not filling in for an injured Tony Armas to save you this year. BoSox are done...put a fork in'em
Posted by: Hawk1990

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 04:43 PM

Quote:

Well I have been posting on Bball board all season AND bashing the BoSox and Yankees from spring training on (especailly with all the DiceK overhype and ummm told you he was overrated for the $ he is getting)...




Look, if you're going to bash the Sox, feel free. And if you want to smack down Dice-K for his mediocre performance, rock on. But would you freakin' STOP with the "he's overpaid" bullsh!t? We've been over this. Dice-K, as a whole, was a league average American League starting pitcher. He makes roughly $6.5 million, which is, shocker, just about league average for a starting pitcher. Ergo, he is NOT overpaid. And no, the $50+ million fee the Red Sox paid his old Japanese team does NOT count, not only because Dice-K didn't receive one thin dime of that money, but also because the Red Sox have already more than made that money back in advertising, merchandising and television rights fees in Japan. Blast him for being overhyped all you want, but harping that you think the guy is overpaid does nothing but trumpet your ignorance to the world.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 05:15 PM

Is the emergence of the Rockies a bigger story than the Red Sox finally winning it all a couple of years ago? I'll go with the Rockies, if they win the WS.
Posted by: Hawk1990

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 05:26 PM

Quote:

Is the emergence of the Rockies a bigger story than the Red Sox finally winning it all a couple of years ago? I'll go with the Rockies, if they win the WS.




As a one year story, probably. In a historical context, no. And if the Cubs finally win next year, on the 100 year anniversary of their last title, it trumps both of them.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 05:28 PM

I doubt it, Rockies World Series doesn't get as much ratings as a Red Sox-Cardinals World Series. Sorry.

Rockies are a great team, but the "curse" story was a big media draw. Anyone will tell you ratings matter to MLB.

Will I be happy if the Rockies win the World Series over the Indians? Of course, because they deserve to win it after that season and it proves everyones theory wrong that the Rockies could never win in their environment.

Now, I will root for the Red Sox over the Rockies. But if it goes 7 games and the Rockies win, will I be angry? No. It just means they are a better team right now. They proved to me in the WS playoff game that they have heart. Something I respect in all teams (except k-state, mizzou and yankees of course).

I'll be happier if the Sox win of course, but I won't be disappointed if the Rockies take it all.

And if the Indians take it, it just means parody in baseball is getting even better, which is awesome.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 05:28 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Is the emergence of the Rockies a bigger story than the Red Sox finally winning it all a couple of years ago? I'll go with the Rockies, if they win the WS.




As a one year story, probably. In a historical context, no. And if the Cubs finally win next year, on the 100 year anniversary of their last title, it trumps both of them.


Couldn't say it any better.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 06:20 PM

I agree with you, but t.v. ratings have nothing to do with it. Personally, I could care less what Joe Blow on the East coast has his channel turned to.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 06:44 PM

Sure they do.... No one is going to say "Oh, remember that time the Rockies and Royals were in the World Series.", but they're going to say "Remember that time the Yankees played the Dodgers in the World Series."

It's just how things go.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 07:29 PM

Manny gets a double.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 08:29 PM

And he had a homerun and it wasn't counted...
Posted by: jaihaux

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 08:35 PM

Actually, Manny had a single on a ball that hit the top of the wall in right center field. It hit the top of the yellow line.

What a lazy piece of crap.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 08:43 PM

It's a homerun
Posted by: jaihaux

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 08:49 PM

Even if it was (I don't think it went over the yellow line) what the hell was he doing only at first base?
Posted by: chiknbut

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 10:28 PM


Apparently admiring the view.

Tool.
Posted by: Hawk1990

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 10:53 PM

Okay, where's the b!itching about Lofton's bush league bat flip on what he thought was ball four? I called it - the dude's been making that move and annoying pitchers for years. Glad to see Beckett call him out on it.
Posted by: Merg311

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/18/07 10:56 PM

Quote:

It's a homerun




He was on first base...looks like a single to me.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 08:10 AM

Quote:

Sure they do.... No one is going to say "Oh, remember that time the Rockies and Royals were in the World Series.", but they're going to say "Remember that time the Yankees played the Dodgers in the World Series."

It's just how things go.




Just because more t.v. sets see something doesn't mean it is a better story. If history records it, people will research it, and realize this was a great story.
Think of all the great stories that happened before events were televised. Many of the greatest stories ever told happened before the boob tube.
Posted by: jaihaux

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 08:26 AM

Quote:

Okay, where's the b!itching about Lofton's bush league bat flip on what he thought was ball four? I called it - the dude's been making that move and annoying pitchers for years. Glad to see Beckett call him out on it.




Was in intentional? I ask because he immediately reached down to pick it up like he dropped it, but who knows?

And why would Beckett be pissed? Heading to first before ball four is called is showing up the umpire, not the pitcher.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 08:29 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Okay, where's the b!itching about Lofton's bush league bat flip on what he thought was ball four? I called it - the dude's been making that move and annoying pitchers for years. Glad to see Beckett call him out on it.




Was in intentional? I ask because he immediately reached down to pick it up like he dropped it, but who knows?

And why would Beckett be pissed? Heading to first before ball four is called is showing up the umpire, not the pitcher.


There's history of him doing it before to Beckett....

Beckett's adrenaline gets pumping good, he takes it offensively, shouts at him...simply as that. Whether it's completely intentional or not by Lofton..doesn't mean much..
Posted by: larryb

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 08:36 AM

Last night was a perfect all around example of why MOST MLB players are a bunch of primma donna assholes. Makes me not want to watch the W.S..

By the way jdavis - The demise of the 2007 Red Sox was greatly exagerated by me. My apologies to you and the Red Sox.
Posted by: KURUSH1530

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 09:26 AM

I can already make the statement that this year's world series ratings will be higher than any in the past 10 years. The Rockies have gained quite a few fans around the nation that wouldn't think about watching baseball. Just because of their story. I think the Red Sox would be better off with two DH's,considering that's what Manny is, and leaving Manny off the field..just have Coco play in between left and center field. How many DH's have made the hall of fame? Well, apparently the Red Sox have two that will be going in after there career's are finished. The Indians may have lost the ALCS last night unless Carmona can come up big in Boston. I really don't think it'll happen and we'll see the Rockies and Red Sox in the Series.
Posted by: larryb

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 09:34 AM

KURUSH1530 - I wouldn't bet on it that "this year's world series ratings will be higher than any in the past 10 years". I will admit the ratings shares the last ten years have sucked and it is possible but I am saying I wouldn't bet on it.
Posted by: Hawk1990

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:08 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Okay, where's the b!itching about Lofton's bush league bat flip on what he thought was ball four? I called it - the dude's been making that move and annoying pitchers for years. Glad to see Beckett call him out on it.




Was in intentional? I ask because he immediately reached down to pick it up like he dropped it, but who knows?

And why would Beckett be pissed? Heading to first before ball four is called is showing up the umpire, not the pitcher.




It's not heading to first early, it's the bat flip. He does it EVERY time he walks. Batters flipping their bat away after a homer hacks off the pitcher because they think of it as showing him up. Lofton is the ONLY guy who does the same thing on a walk, and I can see why that pisses off pitchers too.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:41 AM

You know Manny had the most outfield assists by any major leaguer a few years ago right?

Manny fields, and the people who play with him respect his play.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:44 AM

Quote:

Actually, Manny had a single on a ball that hit the top of the wall in right center field. It hit the top of the yellow line.

What a lazy piece of crap.




Quote:

It's a homerun




It's not a homerun per Jacob's Field ground rules.

By the way, I'm a fan of Manny. The man just loves to play baseball, he doesn't care about anything else but lacing up the cleats and getting on the field. Players around the league even know that. A good majority of players around the league understand that as well. Manny is definitely the only person in the league who could get away with watching a homerun like he does.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:48 AM

Thoughts:

1) Lofton pulled this crap in 2005 on a walk
2) Schilling should ask the HoF for the bloody sock OR
3) Draw some blood and splash it on his new socks

Another Schilling Game 6 start...I expect brilliance.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:49 AM

I love seeing pitchers retaliate for being shown up. You could argue why doesn't he "just strike the guy out next time." Even a dominant pitcher like Beckett can't strike somebody out on a whim. Just hit the guy to give him a reminder of your memory as a pitcher. But always hit in the back or the ass/thigh, throwing at somebody's head intentionally is cowardly.
Posted by: larryb

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:51 AM

Quote:

Thoughts:

1) Lofton pulled this crap in 2005 on a walk
2) Schilling should ask the HoF for the bloody sock OR
3) Draw some blood and splash it on his new socks

Another Schilling Game 6 start...I expect brilliance.




I expect Roger Clemens. The 2007 version.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:52 AM

Quote:

Thoughts:

1) Lofton pulled this crap in 2005 on a walk
2) Schilling should ask the HoF for the bloody sock OR
3) Draw some blood and splash it on his new socks

Another Schilling Game 6 start...I expect brilliance.




Lofton didn't pull "this crap" in 2005. Lofton does this for every walk he receives. As much as I am in favor of pitcher retaliation. I do believe Beckett, as pumped as he was [he threw a brilliant game], did overreact on the Lofton bat-flip. Seriously, a walk is a free base, he has to put his bat somewhere. Might as well put it on homeplate with his leg guard so the bat boy can collect it.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 10:54 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Thoughts:

1) Lofton pulled this crap in 2005 on a walk
2) Schilling should ask the HoF for the bloody sock OR
3) Draw some blood and splash it on his new socks

Another Schilling Game 6 start...I expect brilliance.




I expect Roger Clemens. The 2007 version.




Haha...Roger Clemens is a POS. I lost all respect for the man when he started acting like a baseball diva. I have no problem with not travelling with your team in between outings, but damnit go to spring training, work out with your team, be there for opening day, and earn your full check.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:11 AM

Sorry but Schilling ins't injured... he's as healthy as he was in 2001.

His bat flip is stupid...
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:14 AM

I guess I could add to my above post...Clemens is a POS and Schilling is a gamer.

Lofton...different people have different mannerisms. I was impressed with Beckett last night, he just yelled at Lofton a little bit the Lofton escalated it in my opinion.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:14 AM

I swear..once I start posting, I get nothing done here at work.
Posted by: gquinn225

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:17 AM

Quote:

Sorry but Schilling ins't injured... he's as healthy as he was in 2001.

His bat flip is stupid...




It's Just Kenny being Kenny
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:24 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Sorry but Schilling ins't injured... he's as healthy as he was in 2001.

His bat flip is stupid...




It's Just Kenny being Kenny




Nice...

Most players have something about them that comes off has disrespect to another player. Griffey has watched almost every homerun he's hit...Bonds, enough said...Beckett screams after a big strike outs, which pisses a lot of people off and I think it happened last night...
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:48 AM

You can't deny Beckett has intensity though. I'm glad to see it, because it shows that he actually cares about winning the Series, and not the ALCS, the World Series.

Beckett has been a blessing.

And quinn, funny with kenny being kenny.

Whatever, it's not a big deal. Kenny needs to retire soon, and they won't see each other (hopefully Dice-K and lester get it down Sunday) again.

Manny needs to have a monster game tomorrow. Carmona needs to get rattled early. No more double plays, Sox. That's what's killing you...Thing is, Carmona is a good ground ball pitcher.

Okay, lots of doubles, no singles Sawx...Walks are okay because they raise pitch counts. Earlier they get to the bullpen, the better. Unless of course, its' Bettancourt, who scares the shi- out of me. That dude can pitch.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 11:56 AM

Although it may not be expressed, I have tried to imply in every post of how good of a pitcher Beckett is. His showing in the playoffs, Red Sox and Marlins, give credibility to him. Some of the most beloved pitchers have been mediocre regular season pitchers, but dominant in the post-season. I know if I had made it to the bigs, and I had a choice, I would want to be clutch in the post-season.

Manny is Manny...Manny is tied for the longest hitting streak in LCS history (Pete Rose: HOF'r)

As far as Carmona, seriously where did he come from. He was seriously the worst pitcher on the Indians last year, as a reliever. I won't throw in the Gagne/Carmona comparison, you should already know. Carmona is a sinker ball pitcher, a lot of ground balls if he gets his way. If he leaves a few sinkers hanging, pretty much the whole Sox lineup can take care of it.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 12:15 PM

Quote:

Okay, where's the b!itching about Lofton's bush league bat flip on what he thought was ball four? I called it - the dude's been making that move and annoying pitchers for years. Glad to see Beckett call him out on it.




It's up to Beckett, is he too much of a pu$$y to put Lofton on his a$$ by pitching inside? Do you think Gibson or Drysdale would put up with that?
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 12:17 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Okay, where's the b!itching about Lofton's bush league bat flip on what he thought was ball four? I called it - the dude's been making that move and annoying pitchers for years. Glad to see Beckett call him out on it.




It's up to Beckett, is he too much of a pu$$y to put Lofton on his a$$ by pitching inside? Do you think Gibson or Drysdale would put up with that?




While we're at it, why don't we sharpen our spikes, intentionally hit the catcher in the back swing, and *gasp* put to much pine tar on our bat.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 12:21 PM

JammaHawk: no disrespect, but it is Corleone, not Corleon.

"... don't tell me you're innocent. Because it insults my intelligence and makes me very angry."--Pacino as Michael Corleone.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 12:26 PM

Nice catch. I'll make the change immediatly, I don't want to insult the name of the "Family".
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 12:33 PM

"Never let anyone outside the family know what you're thinking."
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 12:59 PM

Always good to meet another fan of the best Movie's ever made.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:02 PM

I have a nice collection of gangster dvd's including the Trilogy.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:03 PM

I gave you some stars, but it doesn't seem to affect your rating.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:31 PM

I have the Trilogy as well, I've never bothered to play III, I just remember how disapointed I was after seeing it in the theater.
Posted by: pwhittemore

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:39 PM

Wow. All the hate. GO SOX!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: KURUSH1530

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:44 PM

Quote:

You know Manny had the most outfield assists by any major leaguer a few years ago right?

Manny fields, and the people who play with him respect his play.




Well, you learn something new every day. You know Manny also had the most errors and worst Fielding Percentage of any LF starter that same year?
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:53 PM

Quote:

Quote:

You know Manny had the most outfield assists by any major leaguer a few years ago right?

Manny fields, and the people who play with him respect his play.




Well, you learn something new every day. You know Manny also had the most errors and worst Fielding Percentage of any LF starter that same year?




Ouch...assists are easy to come by playing left field at Fenway...
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 01:56 PM

Quote:

Quote:

You know Manny had the most outfield assists by any major leaguer a few years ago right?

Manny fields, and the people who play with him respect his play.




Well, you learn something new every day. You know Manny also had the most errors and worst Fielding Percentage of any LF starter that same year?


That's false... He had the third worst fielding percentage

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fiel...umn=fieldingPct

Once i get home, I'll check out how hurtful these errors are. If Manny commits an error and it deosn/t come back to hurt the team, it doesn't really matter.

He still had 8 more assists than the 2nd most assists in the AL.

Manny isn't paid to field. he's paid to hit.

And yes, Manny would be a DH if Ortiz wasn't on the team. BUt also if Ortiz wasn't on the team, Wily Mo Pena would be the DH for the Sox right now.
Posted by: gquinn225

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 02:02 PM



Manny isn't paid to field. he's paid to hit.





So WTF would you post something to try to make it sound like his fielding IS important. Douche.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 02:05 PM

Because his defense is just a bonus. Duh
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 02:22 PM

Quote:

Because his defense is just a bonus. Duh




Haha...duh.

I can't think of anytime where Manny's defense lost a game for the Sox...

If defense wins championships, does lack of defense lose championships. Since the Rockies are the best defensive team in the history of the game, it seems nobody has a shot against them.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 02:28 PM

You know the 2006 Red Sox were the best defensive team in the history of the game up until the Rockies took that over this year. Red Sox missed the playoffs because of lack of pitching depth (after going into the season thinking they had it). Now defense wins championships is a soccer, basketball and football thing.

PItching AND defense wins championships in baseball. Considering pitching is part of the defensive effort. The Red sox have the best pitching left in the postseason (ERA wise for the year). So we shall see what the does for them. Certainly, Beckett hasn't let them down, it's Schilling and Dice-K that have gone 4 2/3 and let the team down. Wakefield pitching four great innings, then ran into bad luck in game 4. He's also available for game 7...

I see it that the Sox should have only allowed 2 runs at the most in that 5th inning in game 4... They SHOULD have won that game...Boy, would that have changed things.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 02:41 PM

Quote:

You know the 2006 Red Sox were the best defensive team in the history of the game up until the Rockies took that over this year. Red Sox missed the playoffs because of lack of pitching depth (after going into the season thinking they had it). Now defense wins championships is a soccer, basketball and football thing.

PItching AND defense wins championships in baseball. Considering pitching is part of the defensive effort. The Red sox have the best pitching left in the postseason (ERA wise for the year). So we shall see what the does for them. Certainly, Beckett hasn't let them down, it's Schilling and Dice-K that have gone 4 2/3 and let the team down. Wakefield pitching four great innings, then ran into bad luck in game 4. He's also available for game 7...

I see it that the Sox should have only allowed 2 runs at the most in that 5th inning in game 4... They SHOULD have won that game...Boy, would that have changed things.




Well the Sox didn't do enough to position themselves for a championship last year. Pitching does fall under the umbrella of defense. Beckett is a stud, Dice-K is not even close to his hype, Schilling could come out and throw a 2-hitter you just don't know.

As for the Rockies, their pitching has been damn good in the postseason, something like 4th best ERA ever [i could be wrong, off the top of my head]. You can't doubt the Rockies D.

I'm not saying the Sox can't win. I'm just saying it will be interesting. Whichever team makes it out of the AL is supposed to beat the Rockies. Sox and the Tribe were the two favorites entering this year.
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:19 PM

Statistics in no way can measure the true value of a good defensive fielder. There is no stat that shows the number of time a runner didn't try to advance a base because the fielder has a strong accurate arm. No stat will ever show the number balls fielded in the gap to hold a runner to a single instead of extra bases.
I doubt if Manny holds any of those intangables. That said, I'd love to have his bat in my lineup.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:25 PM

Red Sox celebrating the AL East championship.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:25 PM

What are you talking about? Ever heard of zone rating and range factor? Those do a good job of measuring defensive fielders.

Also, everyone knows who has a strong arm...Vlad, Ichiro, Francouer, etc.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:26 PM

BTW, I hate how Joe Buck said he "debuted" this dance that Paps did.

IT's been on youtube for a while: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMl6NWjv5r0
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:36 PM

Actually no I haven't. I'd say Joe average baseball fan, which I am one, rates a fielder by errors, assists.
How is zone rating and range factor calculated.
Yes, everyone knows of the strong arms, but unless you can put a stat on it, it's lost to some people. People know who the fast people are, but it doesn't mean anything to some until they see how many stolen bases they've had.
Like I said earlier in the thread, I'd love to have Manny's bat in my lineup, but to build him up to anything but a below average outfielder is like calling Billy Butler a slick fielding first baseman.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:41 PM

Zone Rating



Definitions:

BIZ: Balls in zone
Plays: Plays made in zone
ZR: Zone rating
OOZ: Plays made out of zone
Chances: BIZ + OOZ
Total Plays: Plays + OOZ

Plays above average is found by finding the league average ZR, multiplying by Chances, and comparing to total plays made. This is for illustration purposes; I am using the total of this group of qualified players instead of the actual league average which would include starters and reserves. In addition, Chris Dial uses (correctly in my opinion) the AL and NL averages instead of an overall MLB average. There are factors (such as pitcher hitting) that make within league comparisons more accurate than overall comparisons.
Posted by: HawkLaw

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/19/07 03:44 PM

Range Factor measures the number of attempts a fielder attempts in an average game.

Range Factor = (assists + putouts)/games
Posted by: jammahawk

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/20/07 07:36 AM

My first thought is that the idea of determining what each players zone is, is very subjective, but then so is awarding an outfielder an error by the official scorer. What the hell, I'll buy into it, I'm somewhat of a stat freak. Who compiles these stats anyway? Seams it would have to be someone present at the game.
I still say there are many things an outfielder does defensively that never appears on a stat sheet.
Posted by: jdavis34

Re: Manny Ramirez - 10/21/07 09:03 PM

oh hey gaiz, I got a outfield assist lol